Redskins lacked leadership, accountability - WP

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Boswell nails it...those talking about the issues need to be part of the solution. It's all fine to bitch and moan now but when this group comes back together the likes of Daniels and Cartwright need to start busting up this crap-culture. If they're just gonna talk about it then don't let the door hit ya guys. The irst thing that needs to happen is Rock needs to put a locker room and public foot in Portis' ass.

washingtonpost.com

Yeah I found it kind of interesting that players were talking about needing more leaders in the locker room...I mean why not be those leaders then?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

Mr. Cooke never did that shit. He just hired the right guys and signed the damn checks and let the football guys do their thing. He just sat back and watched his Skins kick some ass. He wasn't a total egomaniac like Snyder or Jones. He admitted he knew nothing about the ins and outs of running a football team, but was smart enough to hire guys that did. Too bad John Boy was sort of a wuss, then he might have been able to keep the team somehow.

What do you mean he wasn't an ego maniac? What do you mean all he did was sit back and sign the checks? He was in Beathard/Casserly and Gibb's faces all the time. Attending practices, making suggestions, threatening to fire Gibbs, suggesting that Gibbs was a fool for starting Rypien and telling him he should be more like Jimmy Johnson.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Yeah I found it kind of interesting that players were talking about needing more leaders in the locker room...I mean why not be those leaders then?

Players can only take leadership so far. When they're not getting the support from above, it basically undermines any sort of peer leadership. I think leadership is something that needs to start at the top and work it's way down. It's hard to go the other way.

[FRPLG]

I agree w/ you both. I am always struck by the fact that it doesn't seem like we have a real leader on this team. At least one that is front and center. The closest thing it seems we've had in recent years is DHall this past season. To me a leader has to be confident enough in his position to call people out in public. Maybe not throw people under the bus but at least be honest about failures. We never seem to have that. But I also realize the culture has probably killed that some. I just wish we had a player with the balls to put himself in front of the cultural bus and start cracking heads. It sounds like maybe that's what Zorn needed the most.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

I agree w/ you both. I am always struck by the fact that it doesn't seem like we have a real leader on this team. At least one that is front and center. The closest thing it seems we've had in recent years is DHall this past season. To me a leader has to be confident enough in his position to call people out in public. Maybe not throw people under the bus but at least be honest about failures. We never seem to have that. But I also realize the culture has probably killed that some. I just wish we had a player with the balls to put himself in front of the cultural bus and start cracking heads. It sounds like maybe that's what Zorn needed the most.

What Zorn needed was the power to be the true voice of the team. The problem was he was on a short leash right from the start and it didn't take long for certain players to figure that out.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

What Zorn needed was the power to be the true voice of the team. The problem was he was on a short leash right from the start and it didn't take long for certain players to figure that out.

Yeah I guess I meant he needed players to essentially create this since management hadn't. That's a tall order for sure.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

Mr. Cooke never did that shit. He just hired the right guys and signed the damn checks and let the football guys do their thing. He just sat back and watched his Skins kick some ass. He wasn't a total egomaniac like Snyder or Jones. He admitted he knew nothing about the ins and outs of running a football team, but was smart enough to hire guys that did. Too bad John Boy was sort of a wuss, then he might have been able to keep the team somehow.

I don't believe that is exactly true, both Gibbs and Beathard spoke of Cooke's involvement. He did defer to football guys, but he was always involved.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Yeah I found it kind of interesting that players were talking about needing more leaders in the locker room...I mean why not be those leaders then?

My guess is that they tried, but had the rug pulled out from underneath them, either by Snyder directly, or more likely Zorn directly due to pressure from DS/VC. Leadership without authority is useless. The best thing I heard BA say was that he was going to select the coach, and that coach would have full authority to be the leader of the team. I hope it works like that. Alot of dysfunction would go away very quickly if the first time a player tries to go over the HC's head, he got doubly slapped down.

In my own job, I came in as a rookie (kinda like Zorn), and as soon as he put me in my position, when any guys went to him, his reply was you have to go to him. Not too long after that the guys started coming to me, because going over or behind or around me didn't get them anywhere. That's what needs to happen at Ashburn going forward. We will see if DS can do that.

[MTK]

There's no way Shanahan comes in unless he's 100% in charge of his team and is the only sheriff in town. In terms of accountability and leadership, this is a great thing.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

What Zorn needed was the power to be the true voice of the team. The problem was he was on a short leash right from the start and it didn't take long for certain players to figure that out.

I agree. Ideally I wanted Zorn back for a 3rd year, but after all that DS et al put him through, his credibility was already awash.

[Longtimefan]

Someone once said leaders are not made, they're born. As an organization, for the past decade a culture has been established which fosters both the lack of discipline and accountability. Perhaps the new regime will establish a strictly adhered to "chain of command" that will filter player complaints through the proper channels.

When it comes to player discipline (or lack thereof) there are a few players who both past and present stick out like a sore thumb, no need to call them out because we all know who they are. Once the culture that permits these distractions to flourish is changed, discipline and accountability issues can easily be eradicated.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Players can only take leadership so far. When they're not getting the support from above, it basically undermines any sort of peer leadership. I think leadership is something that needs to start at the top and work it's way down. It's hard to go the other way.

Well said. Allen has already displayed more leadership than Cerrato ever did. Hopefully whomever he hires as HC will clean house and get rid of Portis and every other player who allegedly "went over Zorn" to Snyder or Cerrato needs to be removed from the team at the first possibility. Get rid of the rotten eggs and leaders will emerge.

[SmootSmack]

It's just kind of curious to me with Rock especially because his teammates voted him a team captain. I would have assumed that implied they looked up to him as a leader and expected to be one on the field and in the locker room.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

What do you mean he wasn't an ego maniac? What do you mean all he did was sit back and sign the checks? He was in Beathard/Casserly and Gibb's faces all the time. Attending practices, making suggestions, threatening to fire Gibbs, suggesting that Gibbs was a fool for starting Rypien and telling him he should be more like Jimmy Johnson.

Yeah but he never ever went out and signed guys himself. He never went out and got free agents. He left that up to the football people. Plus he never hung out or socialized with players. I think those days are over for Snyder now tha Allen is here. Or let's hope so.

[over the mountain]

heard a soundbite from rock this morning as i was coming into work. he said the skins lacked alil bit of discipline and that there are 2 types of players in the skins locker room. rule guys and guideline guys. rule guys must follow the rules and guidelines guys set their own guidelines.

thats not good for team chemistry and all that other intangible stuff that goes into winning.