Time to revisit my April post...

[Balmerskinsfan]

No shit idiot, but its rather stupid to assume that because I'm bashing Ramsey I must be all about Brunell, don't you think? The real point is that neither of these players have much value. No one is going to give the skins a first round pick for either of these guys. If you read the posts before mine, someone raised the question what did GIBBS do to decrease Ramsey's value. I was simply stating that Ramseys previously inflated value was due to the feeling that he had POTENTIAL. His subsequent play has proven this perception WRONG. RAMSEY decreased his own value by playing medicore, mistake-ridden football. Gibbs had nothing to do with this.

[illdefined]

Originally Posted by Balmerskinsfan

If you read the posts before mine, someone raised the question what did GIBBS do to decrease Ramsey's value.

he pulled him after 3 drives, that's what he did to decrease any value he had.
nice language by the way prick.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Balmerskinsfan

Ramey had value before he played many games because he had POTENTIAL as a young strong armed QB. But then he played enough games for anyone not blinded by burgundy colored glasses to see that he was nothing special at best and a slow, inaccurate INT machine at worst. Gibbs didn't make Ramsey's value plummet, Ramsey did by playing like crap. Teams that were once willing to gamble a higher pick on Ramsey's potential now realize that his actual value is far less. Again, not Gibb's fault, Ramsey's. If you play like a fair-to-middlin' QB, your value is fair-to-middlin'.

Exactly... I agree, Ramsey has had a part in his stock dropping, let's not kid ourselves.

The knocks on him from earlier in his career still remain. He holds on to the ball too long, he doesn't have great touch, and he still makes too many silly mistakes.

That's not Gibbs' fault.

I still think he has some potential and somebody out there will undoubtedly take a chance on him to see if they can tap in to that potential.

[skinsguy]

Yeah, like I said....potential doesn't get you anywhere until it turns into fact.

[illdefined]

if it was so plain to see last season and before, why did Gibbs not only hold on to him, but make him a starter and dedicate the off-season to him?

whatever he was worth at the end of last season, he's certainly not worth that now.

that said, can you imagine the luck of having your first NFL coach being a rookie NFL college coach who didn't believe in tight ends? that wasn't his fault. he's had it very raw here.

[Balmerskinsfan]

3 drives, 0 tds, and how many ints again? Face it, Ramsey has shown himself to be not worth the previous hype. No team in their right mind is going to give up serious value for a guy who plays like a backup QB. This is because he doesn't play particularly well. Whether or not he plays better than Brunell (another mediocre QB) is a separate argument. Look, Ramsey is not good enough to warrant another team giving up a 1st round pick for him, period. Gibbs played him for half a season last year and people saw enough to realize he is not that great. Maybe not a BAD qb, but NOT VERY GOOD. Playing another year of int riddled football would not have suddenly increased his value. And yeah, I thought my language was pretty appropriate given the idiocy of your inital reply.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Balmerskinsfan

And yeah, I thought my language was pretty appropriate given the idiocy of your inital reply.

illdefined knows that I disagree with him on Ramsey. I believe that Ramsey is no better than when last season ended. That even though it's true he only played a quarter and change this season, he had all of minicamps, OTAs, training camp, and preseason to work on his weaknesses-telegraphing passes, reading defenses, forcing plays-and whether he did or not, he just didn't improve on them.

He was given the starter's job and seemed to take it for granted, in my opinion. And, we probably can't afford to have him "learn on the job" during the regular season.

HOWEVER, while I don't agree with illdefined there was nothing idiotic about his post. And no, that language is not appropriate, nor is the personal attack you made on him.

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by Balmerskinsfan

3 drives, 0 tds, and how many ints again? Face it, Ramsey has shown himself to be not worth the previous hype.

and culpepper has 8 ints yet most would trade a 1st + extras for him
that sample size is too small... but i do think the best case for ramsey is to be like bledsoe and the worse case is to end up a career backup... his value has dropped because he hasn't shown improvement, regardless of whether he's been screwed over or not, he's still been around for a while. He's at least as good as others in his class (carr harrington), but that's not really saying much.

that said, can we please not jump to insults so quickly?

[skinsguy]

Assuming we might be able to get a 2nd rounder or a 3rd rounder for Patrick Ramsey isn't a knock on the guy at all. I think that speaks rather well for him.

I think feeling we deserve a first rounder is being a bit unrealistic, but I'll say it again. If we can get a 1st rounder for him, fine with me, I won't complain.

[illdefined]

hope wherever he goes it's not in this division, just imagine the chip on his shoulder (and his knowledge of the Skins, he was supposed to be the starter after all)

[illdefined]

don't think anybody would consider the first 3 drives of the season against a fresh, amped Bears defense a reasonable chance. guess that's where we differ.

don't forget last year those INTs came with game winning TDs. with fifty-fifty Gardner and Toeless Coles as his targets. Ramsey singlehandedly made Cooley a star.

[Balmerskinsfan]

[QUOTE=illdefined]don't think anybody would consider the first 3 drives of the season against a fresh, amped Bears defense a reasonable chance. guess that's where we differ.


No, we differ in that you seem to have forgotten about 7 stinky starts last year and an entire stinky preseason this year. Unlike you, other teams in the league havn't forgotten Ramseys past. This is what has decreased his value.

[illdefined]

Ramsey's value is less now then it was three drives into the season. thats Gibbs doing, even if it was Gibbs who inflated his value by naming him and practing him as a starter in the first place.

[Balmerskinsfan]

It is? Who told you, a group of NFL owners? What a crock. Ramsey's value is the same now as it was when the season started, and that value is: middlin'. Since when does benching a QB have a definitive impact on his value for other teams? Some bench QBs have lots of value (ie Matt Schaub or maybe Jon Kitna) some starting QBs don't have much value (ie Kyle Boller and Ramsey.) Performance and potential dictate value, not what one coach thinks of a players value relative to other players on that same team.

[illdefined]

Originally Posted by Balmerskinsfan

Performance and potential dictate value, not what one coach thinks of a players value relative to other players on that same team.

he didn't get to show either with our new offense in a real game.