2012 Presidential Election (free for all edition)

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by saden1

You forgot New Tyrant Times, my favorite source for country destroying information.

That's one I hadn't heard before.

[Dirtbag59]

I'll jump in soon. Its just to hard to focus on something as bitter and depressing as politics when I have this brand new top of the line PC. Does anyone know how much HD pronz I can fit on a TB?

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

That's one I hadn't heard before.

That's because I just made it up, you know, to keep up with your theme of exposing the true nature of liberal media outlets.

[firstdown]

I was working last night till about 8:30 and at one point I was wondering where all these people were that Obama says helped me get to where I am today. Seemed they must have been off helping someone else.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by firstdown

I was working last night till about 8:30 and at one point I was wondering where all these people were that Obama says helped me get to where I am today. Seemed they must have been off helping someone else.

They helped pave the road to your business and keep it up don't they? They make small business loans available to you don't they?


You Republicans are so fcking retarded that you don't realize your talking points of "Democrats hurt Small Business but Republicans help Small Business" defeats your other talking notation of "no one ever helps me."

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by saden1

They helped pave the road to your business and keep it up don't they? They make small business loans available to you don't they?


You Republicans are so fcking retarded that you don't realize your talking points of "Democrats hurt Small Business but Republicans help Small Business" defeats your other talking notation of "no one ever helps me."

No my good credit got my loan. Calling us fcking retarded. It was you that came to a football site asking questions about running a business. How retarded is that?

[Chico23231]

Originally Posted by firstdown

No my good credit got my loan. Calling us fcking retarded. It was you that came to a football site asking questions about running a business. How retarded is that?

you didnt build that

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

you didnt build that

I didn't do anything I just walked in one day and had an up and running business. I guess I was one of the "LUCKY" people as Obama would say.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by firstdown

No my good credit got my loan. Calling us fcking retarded. It was you that came to a football site asking questions about running a business. How retarded is that?

What are you implying? When it comes to business nothing can be learned from fellow warpathers? There's always an oppertunity to learn from other people's experience despite the plethora of goofballs such as yourself.


But, hey, unlike you I can't do it by myself and there is going to be a long list of people and entities to thank.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Chico23231

you didnt build that

I guess it's just too common sense but least Romney himself gets it in his speech in the 2002 Olympics.



It's shame that he has to go full retarded to appease people like firstdown.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by saden1

What are you implying? When it comes to business nothing can be learned from fellow warpathers? There's always an oppertunity to learn from other people's experience despite the plethora of goofballs such as yourself.


But, hey, unlike you I can't do it by myself and there is going to be a long list of people and entities to thank.

You are 100% correct, in any business or personal success in addition to personal hardwork, dedication, talent, etc. there are always many folks who helped along the way. A parent, coach, mentor, business partner, friend.....even fellow warpather, but none of those folks was provided by gov't. I would say by the grace of God, others may have a different explanation, but either way success is NEVER provided by gov't (unless you're an Obama crony with a green-energy company looking for a loan).

See this previous post: http://www.thewarpath.net/debating-w...tml#post924794

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

You are 100% correct, in any business or personal success in addition to personal hardwork, dedication, talent, etc. there are always many folks who helped along the way. A parent, coach, mentor, business partner, friend.....even fellow warpather, but none of those folks was provided by gov't. I would say by the grace of God, others may have a different explanation, but either way success is NEVER provided by gov't (unless you're an Obama crony with a green-energy company looking for a loan).

See this previous post: http://www.thewarpath.net/debating-w...tml#post924794

What about the community that build the facilities as Romney alluded to? I suspect we both know what Obama was saying but it's easier to just make fun of what he said and have people like firstdown go full retarded with it.

The biggest supporters of small business loans are Republicans...hell, they created the small business administration and it certainly can't be said that it's unhelpful. Goofballs like firstdown think money they get from the bank is actually due to their good credit when in fact it's the government basically giving these banks loan guarantees so they can lend. To top it off, people like him go full retarded and forget that the recent economic downturn basically froze the credit market and the government came in and saved the day.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by saden1

What about the community that build the facilities as Romney alluded to? I suspect we both know what Obama was saying but it's easier to just make fun of what he said and have people like firstdown go full retarded with it.

The biggest supporters of small business loans are Republicans...hell, they created the small business administration and it certainly can't be said that it's unhelpful. Goofballs like firstdown think money they get from the bank is actually due to their good credit when in fact it's the government basically giving these banks loan guarantees so they can lend. To top it off, people like him go full retarded and forget that the recent economic downturn basically froze the credit market and the government came in and saved the day.

Here's the full text (two paras in debate) of what Obama said: "

“There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there.

“If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet. The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”

If all he said was the first para, I'm with you, it's a stretch to expand it to he's saying you basically owe the gov't.

However the second para is what's damning (see what happens without a teleprompter). His references to a "great teacher", "this unbelievable American system", "investments is roads & bridges", "Gov't research creating the Internet" are alluding to gov't funding/programs being responsible for private business success. It's just what he believes, and that's OK. Be who you are, tell the truth about your vision for the country, not what you think will get you elected, and let the chips fall where they may.

That's why I'm very happy with the Ryan pick (whether it ends up costing me $$$ or not). The GOP needs to stop being Dem-lite, or the Diet Coke of liberalism, embrace fiscally conservative policies/values and communicate to the American people (leave the social stuff to the states to decide).

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by saden1

The biggest supporters of small business loans are Republicans...hell, they created the small business administration and it certainly can't be said that it's unhelpful. Goofballs like firstdown think money they get from the bank is actually due to their good credit when in fact it's the government basically giving these banks loan guarantees so they can lend. To top it off, people like him go full retarded and forget that the recent economic downturn basically froze the credit market and the government came in and saved the day.

I don't know how FD financed his business when he started, but when I had the pizza shop all the financing I used was private, SBA loan paperwork was a f-ing nightmare. I get the FDIC program and SBA loan programs, but again they're paid for by taxes all of us pay. I would argue that a successful small business owner pays more in taxes than most and if the choice was to slightly scale back gov't programs to keep taxes level or reduce them I'm sure 99% of small business owners would be in favo of that approach.

And as I've mentioned before, the current economic downturn was primarily sparked by long-term gov't interference in the mortage loan markets. Was the bank bailout necessary to stave off a financial meltdown....most likely.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

....

You Olympians, however, know you didn’t get here solely on your own power. For most of you, loving parents, sisters or brothers, encouraged your hopes, coaches guided, communities built venues in order to organize competitions. All Olympians stand on the shoulders of those who lifted them. We’ve already cheered the Olympians, let’s also cheer the parents, coaches, and communities. All right! [pumps fist].

If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that [on your own]. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet. The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”

I think the context of Obama's speech and previous speeches allude to exactly what he is saying. It's very self-evident what he was saying but perhaps there is a reading comprehension issue at play here? Or is it partisan hackery?


You gleaned over and avoided the issue of whether facilities that communities build constitute government helping individuals succeed as Romney stipulated. Perhaps you should be concerned more about what your candidate believes and did in creating Romneycare than parse what Obama has to say.



At their core these two speeches have exactly same message: