The Silver Lining From Today's Cloud

[Southpaw]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Jacobs is better, Barber is better, Westbrook is better.

If you're simply basing that argument on this season, then I guess all of those backs are better than Tomlinson too...

An argument can be made that Westbrook is a better offensive weapon, but he's not a great runner between the tackles and his blocking is suspect. Barber runs so hard that there's a good chance he'll be used up in three seasons. And saying Jacobs is a better back when he's already been injured in his first season as a starter is a bit unrealistic.

[Meks]

portis - awesome... betts should not get, or gotten the ball IMO.

JC - very impressive to say the least

Offense opening up - much better, yet still a few calls i didnt agree with, like the draw on 3rd in the red zone that didnt help our cause.

Godfrey - make those 2 picks we win, good effort tho.

Springs - solid all around.

O-Line - ge tmore consistent in Pass pro.

McCardel - made that catch on the sidelines no doubt, fuck a juggle he had possesion before going out, horrible call, killed our momentum on that drive for the lead. fucking refs.... great addition.



lot of work needed for a win next week, if we play solid D, we can do it.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SouperMeister

None of those guys you named are running behind an O-line that lost two starters on one side.

O-line or not, the success is still there. Fabini and Wade are comparable to the players who are starters on those lines anyway, so the point is moot.

The point is that they are all better runners, more powerful, more elusive etc. I'm merely pointing this out, not suggesting something ridiculous. Year in and year out (save Jacobs, who is in his first year as a starter), those guys have consistently higher YPC than Portis.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

As well as the "Portis Sucks" crowd as well.

Yup, there aren't too many people talking trash about the back with the 3rd most rushing yards in the entire league.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

they're neck and neck in yards and tds (with portis having the edge in yards over all of them) and portis started the year splitting time with betts, played behind an o line completely wrecked with injuries, and they all have the advantage of playing against defenses that will consistently protect against a deep ball... whereas all of the defenses we face know we want to pound the ball... may as well be facing 4-5 fronts and still getting the job done. That's the only reason he doesn't have the YPC... well, that and the fact that he hasn't been healthy in two years... 2 weeks ago he had his first two consecutive days at practice in almost 2 full years...

You're entitled to your opinion, but I think you couldn't be any farther from reason.

Portis' YPC in Washington: A respectable 4.09 (4.2 this season)

Westbrook's YPC in Philly: An obsured 4.7! (4.8 this season!)

Barber in Dallas: 4.6 YPC (5.4!!!!! this season)

And for kicks, Jacobs is averaging 5.6 YPC this year as a starter.

You can make all the excuses you want for the guy, but you might as well save them. The point is not to show how ineffective Portis is. His production levels here have always been very respectable.

The point is that the "reason" you speak of definitely supports my case. The three teams in our division all have great running games, and we do not. The back is only a percentage of that running game, but the biggest percentage. Portis just hasn't been as effective as the other three guys. He just hasn't. That's not really my opinion, that's easy to see.

My opinion is that going foward, those three guys will continue to average higher than Portis because they are quicker and/or more powerful runners with better vision.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Yup, there aren't too many people talking trash about the back with the 3rd most rushing yards in the entire league.

Dude's been on fire the last two weeks.

He's really got to stop dancing in short yardage situations though. It's OK to hit the wrong hole if you hit it hard and get the first. That's really the only criticism I have for the guy.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Southpaw

If you're simply basing that argument on this season, then I guess all of those backs are better than Tomlinson too...

An argument can be made that Westbrook is a better offensive weapon, but he's not a great runner between the tackles and his blocking is suspect. Barber runs so hard that there's a good chance he'll be used up in three seasons. And saying Jacobs is a better back when he's already been injured in his first season as a starter is a bit unrealistic.

If the standard for Westbrook's between tackles running is applied to Portis...lets just say that I wouldn't want to speak so lowly of a Redskin. Westbrook is an excellent between the tackles runner. Check some running splits....or something. The Eagles lead the NFC East this year in YPC between the tackles by a pretty big margin.

Again, I said that I believe Jacobs is better, but it's really up for debate whether or not he can keep up this pace. I think he can have a career average around 4.7 or 4.8. Portis isn't good enough for that. Over 4 years behind a very solid OL, he's posted respectable YPC numbers. Behind the same line, Westbrook, Barber, and Jacobs would all be averaging more than CP.

Then again, it's not like guys the caliber of those RBs grow on trees.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

My opinion is that going foward, those three guys will continue to average higher than Portis because they are quicker and/or more powerful runners with better vision.

They're also playing in offenses that are much more balanced and have good passing attacks. Teams look at the Redskins and say, "If we stop Portis, we win." Teams look at Dallas and the NYG and don't say, "We've got to stop Barber" or "We've got to stop Jacobs." Moreover, Barber and Jacobs look like very good backs, but their body of work is pretty limited. I'll give you Westbrook, dude's insane and a bigger threat than Portis.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

They're also playing in offenses that are much more balanced and have good passing attacks. Teams look at the Redskins and say, "If we stop Portis, we win." Teams look at Dallas and the NYG and don't say, "We've got to stop Barber" or "We've got to stop Jacobs." Moreover, Barber and Jacobs look like very good backs, but their body of work is pretty limited. I'll give you Westbrook, dude's insane and a bigger threat than Portis.

But we certainly have the horses to be balanced.

If a team had a big hole in pass coverage, you better bet that Al and JC would try to exploit it. Teams really can't afford to stack the run against any team anymore because every team has an able QB.

Except Minnesota...and Tennessee.

Their (Barber and Jacobs) body of work is definitely limited. At this point though, we know what we are having in Portis. The early returns on Jacobs and Barber are incredibly impressive. I can only assume they will continue (which is an assumption, nevertheless).

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Yup. Strangely, the "Andre Carter sucks" crowd has been pretty quiet lately.

Yeah, very strange indeed. The guy plays well, people don't complain. The guy doesn't play well, and people do complain.

Who'd have figured that?

[SouperMeister]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

But we certainly have the horses to be balanced.

If a team had a big hole in pass coverage, you better bet that Al and JC would try to exploit it. Teams really can't afford to stack the run against any team anymore because every team has an able QB.

Except Minnesota...and Tennessee.

Their (Barber and Jacobs) body of work is definitely limited. At this point though, we know what we are having in Portis. The early returns on Jacobs and Barber are incredibly impressive. I can only assume they will continue (which is an assumption, nevertheless).

Put Portis in the Dallas offense with their huge O-line and great passing weapons and he puts up 1,600 yards every year. The most notable thing about Jacobs is how injury prone he has been despite relatively few carries. I'd still take Portis over either. I've already said that Westbrook is a great fit for Philly because they spread the field, and run a ton of draws and screens to get him the ball in space. He would not survive the pounding that Portis is asked to absorb in this offense.

[CHIEF CHUCKING MY SPEAR]

there is nothing postive when you lose especially at home.

[Southpaw]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

If the standard for Westbrook's between tackles running is applied to Portis...lets just say that I wouldn't want to speak so lowly of a Redskin. Westbrook is an excellent between the tackles runner. Check some running splits....or something. The Eagles lead the NFC East this year in YPC between the tackles by a pretty big margin.

Again, I said that I believe Jacobs is better, but it's really up for debate whether or not he can keep up this pace. I think he can have a career average around 4.7 or 4.8. Portis isn't good enough for that. Over 4 years behind a very solid OL, he's posted respectable YPC numbers. Behind the same line, Westbrook, Barber, and Jacobs would all be averaging more than CP.

Then again, it's not like guys the caliber of those RBs grow on trees.

Maybe I shouldn't have use the term "between the tackles" when referring to Westbrook. The Eagles coaching staff(like most good coaches) design runs that suit Westbrook's ability. When Westbrook runs between the tackles, it's usually a quick draw that was setup as a pass, with a gaping hole in the short middle of the field. Just watching the game yesterday, I noticed more than half of his runs were called from a spread formation. Being a shifty back in a pass first offense definitely benefits his rushing totals, and since people seem to act like Portis' two seasons in Denver don't account for anything(since "he was a system back"); Westbrook can't truly be judged as a rusher until he's in a rush first offense. But I am willing to concede that Westbrook is a better offensive weapon, and a better fit for the Eagles scheme.

And automatically assuming that Westbrook, Barber, and Jacobs would do better on this team than Portis is pure speculation with no factual basis. Westbrook would have to change his style about as much as Portis did to fit into the Redskins offensive philosophy. Jacobs looks solid, but that doesn't mean a whole lot when he's already displayed durability issues in his first season as a starter. The injury may have been an anomaly, but that remains to be seen. And while I think Barber runs harder than Portis, I also think he'd end up being run into the ground within a few seasons in this offense.

[jbcjr14]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

Yup, there aren't too many people talking trash about the back with the 3rd most rushing yards in the entire league.

Let us not forget it's all been behind a "makeshift" O-Line as well! Great effort by CP and the O Line the last 2 weeks.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Yeah, very strange indeed. The guy plays well, people don't complain. The guy doesn't play well, and people do complain.

Who'd have figured that?

I know that you were leading the charge on Carter so you're going to defend the Carter-bashing, but why are you going to be a smart-ass? "People" weren't just complaining about his lack of production, they were saying just how awful he is, that it was another boneheaded move by the front office, etc. "People" had given up on the guy and conclusively decided how good/bad he was 6 games into his arrival in D.C. I should know by now that most Redskins fans are impulsive, hastily judge things, and tend to overstate their cases, but I'm still tired of it. The Carter-haters who predicted his "bust-ness" are wrong and now that they have some egg on their faces, they are silent.