Joe Gibbs...YOU CAN'T BE F*@%ING CONSERVATIVE ALL THE TIME!!!!!

skin4Life28 · 12-26-2004, 10:05 PM

It was both there faults, but I am not blaming anyone. Deep ball they caught it tough shit. I have seen worse losses in my life time. Thats why 5-9 teams do not belong in the playoffs. They cannot stop the big play as far as Browns fumble goes that is what killed us. Giving the Boy's another chance "tisk tisk". I am not going to bash Taylor the man is not perfect people cannot expect him to stop every play. Ed reed can't even do that. Just another loss, lets get ready for next week. We have a very tough test against the Vikes, especially with the loss of Smoot. We will see who will be here next year in the secondary. Another BRILLANT game by Mr. Peirce the man just flat out has so much heart and is leading this defense. I really loved when he called that timeout in the fourth because some screw up did not cover a reciever then yelled at him like a boyfriend catching his girl cheating on him "CLASSIC". That is what a leader does he raises his voice in a time of need. Portis going down today I feel was the biggest blow we became so one dimensional and Ramsey just showed me again why I am not sold on him. Mr. Inconsistency I say I know those picks were not his, but he looked scared today. For two series I just watched his feet and boy a track runner doesn't move his feet that much. Also with this loss we moved up like 6 spots in the draft. Well I have spoken my mind bring on the bashing I'm here all week.

BossHog · 12-26-2004, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Why is this all Sean Taylor's fault? Many posts on this thread point to him getting burned because he's a rookie.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Shawn Springs the cornerback covering on that play?

Well from what I saw and what the commentator pointed out, a lot of times our defense leaves the flats open. Running a two minute offense without any timeouts, DAL was likely to use the sidelines to control the clock, as supposed to throwing a completion in the middle of he field and having to spike the ball. This is the reason DAL was able to march down the field often in the second half. On the DAL TD, apparently G. Williams wanted to give Testicleverde a different look. From what I saw, Springs was playing a 'flat zone' (that's why he, with not much effort, jammed the WR before letting him release). Now if you remember, or if you watch the play again, there was a WR in the slot (Keyshawn?!) on the same side who ran a deep post. That put a lot of pressure on Sean Taylor as it would on any other safety in the league. And again, without a really good pass rush, that allowed the WRs to get deeper into the secondary where there was little help. I'll say it again. It would've been a better play if Springs would have blitzed. I expect G. Williams thought he could get an INT if a DAL WR ran a 'out' and Springs was playing a flat zone.

Daseal · 12-27-2004, 12:31 AM

Guys: I agree that putting the ball in our defenses hands isn't the worst thing in the world, but please. 3 runs up the middle? HOW can you possibly defend that. We hadn't gotten any yards on the previous two plays and the 3rd we would rip it up. I'm sorry, but if we get a first down who cares if they still have one more TO, we can run the clock way down and seal it. Conservative football has burned us so many times. It's infuriating.

Gmanc711 · 12-27-2004, 01:26 AM

Normally I agree that Gibbs is too conservative. However, I agree with how he went about it at the end of the game, trying to run the clock out. Thats just how you do it. As somone pointed out, The Cheifs did the same thing yetserday, and should have lost the game because of it. I think our goaline playcalling is awful, but in the situation, I dont think the calling was too conservaitve, I think its just what you do. The Game as a whole, yeah, theres things we could have done different, but as for running out the clock, I think you run the ball.

SmootSmack · 12-27-2004, 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gmanc711

Normally I agree that Gibbs is too conservative. However, I agree with how he went about it at the end of the game, trying to run the clock out. Thats just how you do it. As somone pointed out, The Cheifs did the same thing yetserday, and should have lost the game because of it. I think our goaline playcalling is awful, but in the situation, I dont think the calling was too conservaitve, I think its just what you do. The Game as a whole, yeah, theres things we could have done different, but as for running out the clock, I think you run the ball.

I absolutely agree with you. It's easy to say we should have attacked at the end of the game. But why take that risk? Stay simple, protect the ball, hope to get a first down. Don't try any trickery or more importantly risk an unecessary turnover.

Our defense is our strength so why wouldn't we put the game in their hands?

LongTimeSkinsFan · 12-27-2004, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smootsmack

I absolutely agree with you. It's easy to say we should have attacked at the end of the game. But why take that risk? Stay simple, protect the ball, hope to get a first down. Don't try any trickery or more importantly risk an unecessary turnover.

Our defense is our strength so why wouldn't we put the game in their hands?

I would agree with you in principle. However I don't understand the defensive playcalling on the last Dallas possession. All game long we were pressuring Vinny, sacking him or making him check down or throw the ball away. Why all of a sudden did we go to what looked like prevent coverage? And as far as the offense was concerned I certainly wouldn't be suggesting any trick plays, but fer crying out loud, you marched right down the field by mixing up run and pass- why the hell not stick with it! I just think that if they would have played and called the the last two offensive possessions like they did their TD drive, we could have walked home with a W.

SmootSmack · 12-27-2004, 02:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LongTimeSkinsFan

I would agree with you in principle. However I don't understand the defensive playcalling on the last Dallas possession. All game long we were pressuring Vinny, sacking him or making him check down or throw the ball away. Why all of a sudden did we go to what looked like prevent coverage? And as far as the offense was concerned I certainly wouldn't be suggesting any trick plays, but fer crying out loud, you marched right down the field by mixing up run and pass- why the hell not stick with it! I just think that if they would have played and called the the last two offensive possessions like they did their TD drive, we could have walked home with a W.

Well, you're right about the prevent defense. I didn't quite get that either. I'm not sure they exactly played a prevent defense but they certainly weren't as aggressive toward the end of the last drive as they were at the beginning.

And I hear what you're saying about mixing things up. And it worked great on that TD drive, no question about it. But they had to take a chance because they were trailing at the time. With the lead and a strong defense I just don't think you put the ball in the air.

NY_Skinsfan · 12-27-2004, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LongTimeSkinsFan

I would agree with you in principle. However I don't understand the defensive playcalling on the last Dallas possession. All game long we were pressuring Vinny, sacking him or making him check down or throw the ball away. Why all of a sudden did we go to what looked like prevent coverage? And as far as the offense was concerned I certainly wouldn't be suggesting any trick plays, but fer crying out loud, you marched right down the field by mixing up run and pass- why the hell not stick with it! I just think that if they would have played and called the the last two offensive possessions like they did their TD drive, we could have walked home with a W.

i agree it seemed like the second to last dallas possession we punished vinny and then on the last possession we sat back and waited for him to pass the ball...i didn't understand. i also agree that it was best left up to the defense to hold the win..but isn't it obvious we play our best defense when we are really aggressive.

Daseal · 12-27-2004, 10:31 AM

Running out the clock is grand, but you can really run it out if you get 1 first down. I don't think a playaction pass to a short receiver (first down marker) would be too bad. The same amount of time is on the clock, only they have one more time out. Which would have been used and given us more time to score.

cpayne5 · 12-27-2004, 10:45 AM

Suppose one of those passes had fallen incomplete and the clock had stopped and Dallas hadn't been forced to use a TO? People would have been all over Gibbs for not running it and having the game fall into the D's hands. Kinda darned if you do, danged if you don't.

LongTimeSkinsFan · 12-27-2004, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daseal

Running out the clock is grand, but you can really run it out if you get 1 first down. I don't think a playaction pass to a short receiver (first down marker) would be too bad. The same amount of time is on the clock, only they have one more time out. Which would have been used and given us more time to score.

I'm thinking you meant "if you can't get 1 first down" and I completely agree. Plain and simple, this team does not have the offensive line to play smashmouth football with anybody for a running back, even a John Riggins. Our last two offensive possessions Dallas was flooding the box to stop the run and our OH-line was being completely OHverwhelmed. A quick hitter to Cooley about 4 or 5 yds over the middle or a flat route probably would have gotten the job done. While we may have been a little more desparate on the TD drive, the playcalling was sharp with a good mix of pass and run and it kept the Dallas D completely on their heels. Until we get a few more linemen to complement the likes of Randy Thomas and Chris Samuels (and no, I'm not totally sold on hickory-dickory Dockery yet) we're not going to be able to challenge a team to stop us like in the old Gibbs days. The personnel is simply not there to do it.

cpayne5 · 12-27-2004, 10:59 AM

I should also say that there is a master plan at work here, I believe. I hope we all see this when we start winning.

Daseal · 12-27-2004, 11:39 AM

Master plan? Please, elaborate. We've tried this run up the middle 3 times strategy in various situations, I can't think of a single time it worked. As far as people yelling at Gibbs for trying a short throw. I don't think so. If we got a single first down the game woulda been basicly ours. I think it's ridiculous to not even attempt to get the first down to seal the game. Our defense is great, but if you give a team enough chances they'll get something.

Redskins_P · 12-27-2004, 11:45 AM

Guys, if we had an offensive line that gave our backs some holes to run through, we wouldn't have to pass in that situation. Good teams run out the clock by pounding the ball. It doesn't matter who's running it.

I think our o-line struggled all day yesterday against a mediocre at best d-line. If we can't run the ball and protect the QB, you're in big trouble.

Daseal · 12-27-2004, 11:49 AM

Hey, Redskins_P, we don't have said offensive line, therefore we shouldn't pretend we do! Not all teams run 3 times in that situation, many teams will throw a HIGH PERCENTAGE SHORT PASS! Something that's bound to get yards. Everyone going out would have had man coverage and I think a route to Cooley, Gardner, or McCants could have easily done the trick.

If we hand it back to our defense with 20 seconds and no timeouts, it's a much different ballgame.

12-27-2004, 01:26 AM	#49
Gmanc711 Thank You, Sean. Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Gaithersburg, MD Age: 39 Posts: 7,506	Normally I agree that Gibbs is too conservative. However, I agree with how he went about it at the end of the game, trying to run the clock out. Thats just how you do it. As somone pointed out, The Cheifs did the same thing yetserday, and should have lost the game because of it. I think our goaline playcalling is awful, but in the situation, I dont think the calling was too conservaitve, I think its just what you do. The Game as a whole, yeah, theres things we could have done different, but as for running out the clock, I think you run the ball. __________________ #21

12-27-2004, 10:45 AM	#55
cpayne5 Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,807	Suppose one of those passes had fallen incomplete and the clock had stopped and Dallas hadn't been forced to use a TO? People would have been all over Gibbs for not running it and having the game fall into the D's hands. Kinda darned if you do, danged if you don't. __________________ "It's not about what you've done, but what's been done for you."

12-27-2004, 10:59 AM	#57
cpayne5 Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,807	I should also say that there is a master plan at work here, I believe. I hope we all see this when we start winning. __________________ "It's not about what you've done, but what's been done for you."

12-26-2004, 10:05 PM	#46
skin4Life28 Special Teams Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Raleigh, NC Age: 38 Posts: 447	It was both there faults, but I am not blaming anyone. Deep ball they caught it tough shit. I have seen worse losses in my life time. Thats why 5-9 teams do not belong in the playoffs. They cannot stop the big play as far as Browns fumble goes that is what killed us. Giving the Boy's another chance "tisk tisk". I am not going to bash Taylor the man is not perfect people cannot expect him to stop every play. Ed reed can't even do that. Just another loss, lets get ready for next week. We have a very tough test against the Vikes, especially with the loss of Smoot. We will see who will be here next year in the secondary. Another BRILLANT game by Mr. Peirce the man just flat out has so much heart and is leading this defense. I really loved when he called that timeout in the fourth because some screw up did not cover a reciever then yelled at him like a boyfriend catching his girl cheating on him "CLASSIC". That is what a leader does he raises his voice in a time of need. Portis going down today I feel was the biggest blow we became so one dimensional and Ramsey just showed me again why I am not sold on him. Mr. Inconsistency I say I know those picks were not his, but he looked scared today. For two series I just watched his feet and boy a track runner doesn't move his feet that much. Also with this loss we moved up like 6 spots in the draft. Well I have spoken my mind bring on the bashing I'm here all week.

12-27-2004, 12:31 AM	#48
Daseal Puppy Kicker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arlington, Virginia Age: 41 Posts: 8,341	Guys: I agree that putting the ball in our defenses hands isn't the worst thing in the world, but please. 3 runs up the middle? HOW can you possibly defend that. We hadn't gotten any yards on the previous two plays and the 3rd we would rip it up. I'm sorry, but if we get a first down who cares if they still have one more TO, we can run the clock way down and seal it. Conservative football has burned us so many times. It's infuriating.

12-27-2004, 10:31 AM	#54
Daseal Puppy Kicker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arlington, Virginia Age: 41 Posts: 8,341	Running out the clock is grand, but you can really run it out if you get 1 first down. I don't think a playaction pass to a short receiver (first down marker) would be too bad. The same amount of time is on the clock, only they have one more time out. Which would have been used and given us more time to score.

12-27-2004, 11:39 AM	#58
Daseal Puppy Kicker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arlington, Virginia Age: 41 Posts: 8,341	Master plan? Please, elaborate. We've tried this run up the middle 3 times strategy in various situations, I can't think of a single time it worked. As far as people yelling at Gibbs for trying a short throw. I don't think so. If we got a single first down the game woulda been basicly ours. I think it's ridiculous to not even attempt to get the first down to seal the game. Our defense is great, but if you give a team enough chances they'll get something.

12-27-2004, 11:45 AM	#59
Redskins_P Fight for old DC! Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Aldie, VA Age: 46 Posts: 4,101	Guys, if we had an offensive line that gave our backs some holes to run through, we wouldn't have to pass in that situation. Good teams run out the clock by pounding the ball. It doesn't matter who's running it. I think our o-line struggled all day yesterday against a mediocre at best d-line. If we can't run the ball and protect the QB, you're in big trouble.

12-27-2004, 11:49 AM	#60
Daseal Puppy Kicker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Arlington, Virginia Age: 41 Posts: 8,341	Hey, Redskins_P, we don't have said offensive line, therefore we shouldn't pretend we do! Not all teams run 3 times in that situation, many teams will throw a HIGH PERCENTAGE SHORT PASS! Something that's bound to get yards. Everyone going out would have had man coverage and I think a route to Cooley, Gardner, or McCants could have easily done the trick. If we hand it back to our defense with 20 seconds and no timeouts, it's a much different ballgame.

Joe Gibbs...YOU CAN'T BE F*@%ING CONSERVATIVE ALL THE TIME!!!!!

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