Joyner: Cooley underrated

[12thMan]

There is no comparing Winslow and Gates. None.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by skinsfan_nn

Yeap your on CRACK for sure.

First of all fans are attached to Cooley because he's one of the VERY BEST TE in the entire league, and happens to be a SKIN! As you can tell by stats witten has been getting his respect as deserved, but Cooley isn't a cowgirl so what's the point? If your Really Good, your Really Good doesn't matter what team you play for?

If you don't think a top TE in the league is a big investment, your dead wrong, just look at the top TE's contracts in the league, witten, heap, shockey, or any top 5 TE for instance, maybe then you'll understand a top TE in the league is starting to require a big check.

With that said Cooley is a premier TE in this league and needs to be paid accordingly in DC!

I am not on any crack. You guys act like if Cooley left, our offense would totally fall apart. I love the guy and def DO NOT want him to leave and we should pay him accordingly. But there are by my count about 10-13 guys in the NFL that have his skill set. It's not like we could never find a guy to do what he does. My point is he should be paid like some of the top guys, but it's not like he isn't replaceable. That's all I'm saying becasue I think he is replaceable. Put it this way. If it came down to us getting a pass rusher, or keeping Cooley I would take the pass rusher becasue they are harder to find.

Here are TE's in the NFL that can do what Cooley does, or do it better than him IMO.

Witten
Heap
Crumpler
Gates
Watson
Gonzalez
V. Davis
Shockey
LJ Smith
Dallas Clark
The TE drafted by Chicago forgot his name.
D. Graham
Winslow

[TheMalcolmConnection]

I'd take out Davis, LJ Smith, Dallas Clark and Winslow. Still though, when you look at that list compared to the sheer number of TEs in the league, that's only a FRACTION. Also, remember the TEs who are cut and never even saw a roster. Not that easily replaceable if you ask me.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by dmek25

how can any redskin fans say the have a favorite cowboys player?this is.... absurd

and bedlam says i'm on crack????????????????????????????????????????? if i'm on crack he's on coke! ;-)

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I am not on any crack. You guys act like if Cooley left our offense would totally fall apart. I love the guy and def DO NOT want him to leave and we should pay him accordingly. But there are by my count about 10-13 guys in the NFL that have his skill set. It's not like we could never find a guy to do what he does. My point is he should be paid like some of the top guys, but it's not like he isn't replaceable. That's all I'm saying becasue I think he is replaceable. Put it this way. If it came down to us getting a pass rusher, or keeping Cooley I would take the pass rusher becasue they are harder to find.

Here are TE's in the NFL that can do what Cooley does, or do it better than him.

Witten
Heap
Crumpler
Gates
Watson
Gonzalez
V. Davis
Shockey
LJ Smith
Dallas Clark
The TE drafted by Chicago forgot his name.
D. Graham
Winslow

He's replaceable. What does that mean exactly? You can line another body in that position and the Redskins will be just as fine? If that's the case, couldn't that same be said of, well, all the positions across the board?

If you believe there are curently 13 TE better than Chris Cooley, then there's no trying to reason this point.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection

I'd take out Davis, LJ Smith, Dallas Clark and Winslow. Still though, when you look at that list compared to the sheer number of TEs in the league, that's only a FRACTION. Also, remember the TEs who are cut and never even saw a roster. Not that easily replaceable if you ask me.

You would take out Winslow? Really??? I mean the guys first year on the field ( after a broken leg and torn acl ) he had 90 cates. That is pretty damn impressive to me. And I don't care if Clev. didn't have any WR's cause he still had to get open. If you are catching that many balls you are consistently beating the LB's and DB's.

I think LJ Smith is a vey solid player and Clark would get alot more balls if he were in any other offense.

[EARTHQUAKE2689]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I am not on any crack. You guys act like if Cooley left, our offense would totally fall apart. I love the guy and def DO NOT want him to leave and we should pay him accordingly. But there are by my count about 10-13 guys in the NFL that have his skill set. It's not like we could never find a guy to do what he does. My point is he should be paid like some of the top guys, but it's not like he isn't replaceable. That's all I'm saying becasue I think he is replaceable. Put it this way. If it came down to us getting a pass rusher, or keeping Cooley I would take the pass rusher becasue they are harder to find.

Here are TE's in the NFL that can do what Cooley does, or do it better than him IMO.

Witten
Heap
Crumpler
Gates
Watson
Gonzalez
V. Davis
Shockey
LJ Smith
Dallas Clark
The TE drafted by Chicago forgot his name.
D. Graham
Winslow

greg olsen

[TheMalcolmConnection]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

You would take out Winslow? Really??? I mean the guys first year on the field ( after a broken leg and torn acl ) he had 90 cates. That is pretty damn impressive to me. And I don't care if Clev. didn't have any WR's cause he still had to get open. If you are catching that many balls you are consistently beating the LB's and DB's.

I think LJ Smith is a vey solid player and Clark would get alot more balls if he were in any other offense.

My judgment is reserved until I see that Winslow can do it again. Smith is solid, but again he's not great like Cooley. And Clark gets the balls he gets BECAUSE of the offense he's in. Any other team makes him less than good.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

He's replaceable. What does that mean exactly? You can line another body in that position and the Redskins will be just as fine? If that's the case, couldn't that same be said of, well, all the positions across the board?

If you believe there are curently 13 TE better than Chris Cooley, then there's no trying to reason this point.

It means that someone who does what he does, which is catch anywhere from 50 -70 balls and scores 5-7 times is replaceable. In other words you could find someone in the draft or in free agency to get that type of production. Yes it's tough to find but it's not like it's impossible.

I didn't say all of those guys were better. Some of them are better than Cooley. I said they had equal skills or better skills.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection

My judgment is reserved until I see that Winslow can do it again. Smith is solid, but again he's not great like Cooley. And Clark gets the balls he gets BECAUSE of the offense he's in. Any other team makes him less than good.

So you are saying Cooley is a great TE? I wouldn't say that quite yet. I wouldn't put him in Gates or Tony G. league quite yet. He could get there. But he ain't there yet.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Look at what Gates has done so far in his career:

265 catches, 3378 yards, 12.7 avg, 34 TDs.

As for Winslow:

94 catches, 925 yards, 9.8 avg, 3 TDs.

So why would I think Winslow is better than Gates??

I can't wait to hear this logic.

Product of offense? Maybe? Possibly?

All you've done is shown that Gates has been given a lot more oppertunities in his career. This would be a stupid point to debate anyway.

I think that given identital oppertunites that Winslow would produce a bit more than Gates. I also happen to think Winslow is the better blocker which is half of a TE's game anyway.

Even if I'm wrong, I don't see how in the world you could think its absured. Why have a discussion fourm if only conventional logic can be right?

We can't discuss TEs and not look at blocking first. We just can't.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

It means that someone who does what he does, which is catch anywhere from 50 -70 balls and scores 5-7 times is replaceable. In other words you could find someone in the draft or in free agency to get that type of production. Yes it's tough to find but it's not like it's impossible.

I didn't say all of those guys were better. Some of them are better than Cooley. I said they had equal skills or better skills.

Replaceable implies that its not all that hard to find. I mean, some very good players can be replaceable, but only at positions in which such skills are quite common for the league.

[skinsWill]

Well i just ran across this article on NFL.com and its the top 100 fantasy players (I know its only for fantasy but its also a ranking of top players at theri positions and this guy ranked Cooley as the #6 TE overall)

NFL.com - NFL Fantasy

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection

My judgment is reserved until I see that Winslow can do it again. Smith is solid, but again he's not great like Cooley. And Clark gets the balls he gets BECAUSE of the offense he's in. Any other team makes him less than good.

Both you and Skinsfan69 have good points on Winslow. I don't know exactly how good he is, but theres no reason to think that he isn't going to be one of the best TEs in the league.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by skinsWill

Well i just ran across this article on NFL.com and its the top 100 fantasy players (I know its only for fantasy but its also a ranking of top players at theri positions and this guy ranked Cooley as the #6 TE overall)

NFL.com - NFL Fantasy

Chris Cooley is a very good fantasy TE.

That said, when trying to pick fantasy receivers and TEs, the ONLY guys you want to grab are the ones who are going to get the most passes thrown at them. Everything else is unimportant.

So this rankings list is just as solid as anyone elses, because we all know Cooley is going to get looks, its just a matter of whether or not he gets more looks than every other TE in the league.