McNabb, Warner, and the Hall of Fame

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

That's the difference between the Air Coryell and WCO, one is run heavy and the other pass heavy. Aikman was in the run heavy offense and so was Art Monk and unfortunately that's what delayed his entrance into the HOF because of the lack of "numbers". My feeling is that having "nice stats" is what gets people into the HOF which is a bunch of shit. If McNabb gets in, so should Theismann.

Theismann in the HOF?? No way. IMO I think McNabb is a little better than JT. JT was a full time starter for about 7 1/2 to 8 years and 4 of those years he was about as average as it gets. And during those average years we never made the playoffs, he never made the team better or could not carry a team like McNabb does. 82, 83 and 84 were his best years and 3 good seasons doesn't get you in. In 85 when he broke his leg he was playing pretty bad and Gibbs refused to bench him. But maybe he'd get more of a look if we win that 83 SB cause he was the QB of one of the best offenses of all time.

[Jake2008]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I saw enough of Aikman to tell me he was a damn good QB and much better than his numbers indicated. A bust? I really doubt that.

Aikman's first couple of years were pathetic and it wasn't until they drafted Smith and had probably the best offensive line ever in the NFL and Irvin that he put up just decent numbers. His best year over his carreer in most any category doesn't even break the top 100 all time. And his last 4 years when the team started breaking up were very average also. Take him off the Cowboys and put him in Detroit and my guess is most people wouldn't even know who he is today.

Of all teams we should know that you can make a QB look good with a great line and team around him. We have done it a few times.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Don't kid yourself, Brady is already a pretty sure thing. He's got 3 rings, 2 SB MVPs, 1 league MVP, and his numbers are impressive. 26,446 passing yards, 197 TDs, 86 INTs, 63% completions, 92.9 rating.

I don't think there will much of a discussion in the selection committee regarding whether he gets in. He's as unanimous no questions asked HoF and rightly so.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Warner hasn't had a short career, he's been in the NFL 11 years now.

Problem with Warner is that he has had some awful years, not average but awful.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by saden1

Problem with Warner is that he has had some awful years, not average but awful.

Ok, when exactly?

The only awful season I see is 2002 but he only played in 7 games.

Kurt Warner: Career Stats

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Jake2008

Aikman's first couple of years were pathetic and it wasn't until they drafted Smith and had probably the best offensive line ever in the NFL and Irvin that he put up just decent numbers. His best year over his carreer in most any category doesn't even break the top 100 all time. And his last 4 years when the team started breaking up were very average also. Take him off the Cowboys and put him in Detroit and my guess is most people wouldn't even know who he is today.

Of all teams we should know that you can make a QB look good with a great line and team around him. We have done it a few times.

Meh, you can play that game with just about anyone. What would Montana and Young have been without Rice and those talented 49ers teams?

You can't pick and choose to take away this or that. His resume is what it is, a Hall of Fame one. There's no debating it at this point because he's already in.

[jamf]

I would not say McNabb is a HOF'er.
If you had to pick a QB to lead your team in the superbowl, Would you Pick Aikmen, Young or McNabb?
I doubt anyone here would start McNabb over those two guys.

If you looked at current NFL QBs, Which one would you want to start for your team in the Superbowl?
My top 5 is:
1: Brady
2: Peyton Manning
3: Warner
4: Brees
5: Favre

McNabb doesn't crack the top 5 list of current best QBs.

Warner: Yes. Superbowl ring, MVPs and Had another MVP type year this year.
The greatest show on turf wasn't so great without him. Leinart couldn't do anything with Fitz and Boldin last year. There's more too his game than just being the beneficiary of great WRs.

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by jamf

I would not say McNabb is a HOF'er.
If you had to pick a QB to lead your team in the superbowl, Would you Pick Aikmen, Young or McNabb?
I doubt anyone here would start McNabb over those two guys.

If you looked at current NFL QBs, Which one would you want to start for your team in the Superbowl?
My top 5 is:
1: Brady
2: Peyton Manning
3: Warner
4: Brees
5: Favre

McNabb doesn't crack the top 5 list of current best QBs.

Warner: Yes. Superbowl ring, MVPs and Had another MVP type year this year.
The greatest show on turf wasn't so great without him. Leinart couldn't do anything with Fitz and Boldin last year. There's more too his game than just being the beneficiary of great WRs.

Did you watch Favre this year? Dude was garbage after October. How you have an '08 legit top 5 without Rivers is highly questionable as well. Either way, it's not a question of is he the best right now, but over the span of his career and McNabb has consistently been a winner and productive.

[sportscurmudgeon]

Championships are only one part of the equation here. If they were a litmus test, then Sonny Jurgensen would not be in the HoF. His only brush with a championship team came as a benchwarmer with the 1960 Philadelphia Eagles. He had a losing record as a starting QB for his career.

Does anyone here think that Theisman or Williams or Rypien was a better QB than Jurgensen because those three were on Super Bowl winners and Jurgensen was not? If you do, that would indicate to me that one of two things is going on here:


1. You never saw Sonny Jurgensen play football - - or - -

2. You are living in a delusion.

[jamf]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Did you watch Favre this year? Dude was garbage after October. How you have an '08 legit top 5 without Rivers is highly questionable as well. Either way, it's not a question of is he the best right now, but over the span of his career and McNabb has consistently been a winner and productive.

The key point is which QB I want to start a SuperBowl. I did consider Rivers and he had a much better year than Favre but I would rather have Favre in a SB Game. It was a tossup but I wouldn't feel comfortable with Rivers just yet.


BTW, Colt Brennen was my 6th choice JK.

[Miller101]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Meh, you can play that game with just about anyone. What would Montana and Young have been without Rice and those talented 49ers teams?

You can't pick and choose to take away this or that. His resume is what it is, a Hall of Fame one. There's no debating it at this point because he's already in.

I would debate it........call me a hater, but he's overated!

He had a wide reciever that could almost always push off and get open.

He also had a really good offensive line. If he had wanted too he could have put the football on the ground and counted to ten before throwing a pass!

Plus, he's the reason why we got that infamous tuck rule now! You know from that game back in the '92 season...........I think it was in '92. When Irvin failed to push off off Darrell Green so Aikman was forced to 'tuck' the football; then one of our guys knocks it out of his hands. Emmitt picked up it then fumbled it too. One of our guys jumped on it and we won......................you remember what I'm talking about right? Just for that dumb rule alone he shouldn't have ever gotten in!

Last but not least........he can't even take a hit! I know Arrington leveled him, but still! HOFer's are supposed to be able to get up from those!

[#21Taylor4Ever]

Warner is indeed a HOF'er, but I'm still unsure about McNabb. If Donovan wins a SB this season, then maybe he has a slim chance.

[Giantone]

Originally Posted by jamf

The key point is which QB I want to start a SuperBowl. I did consider Rivers and he had a much better year than Favre but I would rather have Favre in a SB Game. It was a tossup but I wouldn't feel comfortable with Rivers just yet.


BTW, Colt Brennen was my 6th choice JK.

Rivers, LOL..good one!

[DarkKnight]

Originally Posted by Meks

mcnabb is not marino.

Meaning what!!! be honest in what way, hell someone should ask you what you mean, cause DM numbers are better than alot of HOF.... why isnt he???

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Ok, when exactly?

The only awful season I see is 2002 but he only played in 7 games.

Kurt Warner: Career Stats

We're talking HoF here so you can include any year where he didn't play much or the numbers were poor by most standards.

2002 (started 0-3 and threw 7 INTs and 1 TD...he injured his finger).
2003 (was replaced by Bulger after fumbling six times in the home opener).
2004 (played 10 games, 5-4 record with 6 TDs and 4 INTs...was replaced by manning due to poor performance).
2005 (played 10 games, 2-8 record with 11 TDs and 9 INTs).
2006 (played 7 games, with a 1-4 record 6TDs and 5 INTs and poor play he was once again replaced by Leinart).


I am now more than ever convinced that he doesn't deserve to be in the HoF. If Warner gets in I think Terrell Davis should also get in.