Sam Bradford remains projected pick to Redskins

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

two things we absolutely should not do with our first round pick are:

1) Draft a defensive player, especially a safety. The move would not fill one of our top 10 team needs and i highly doubt a safety would even be close to being the BPA on the board at 5/6 or wherever we'll be picking.

2) Draft a running back before our offensive line is fixed. Its going to take 2-3 years to really fix our line. Running backs generally are only productive for 5-6 years. so if we draft a running back that high, we're essentially wasting half of his productive career behind a dismal offensive line.

We'd be far better suited to trade UP to get Bradford, Suh, or Okung than we would be to make either of those moves at 5. I even have reservations about drafting a QB at 5. Any player drafted that high should be a day 1 starter and all of the QBs in this years draft are "projects." Not a one of them is NFL ready.

1. Eric Berry is, I think, worth seriously considering at #5 but I'd be surprised if he's there. Suh is great and will probably the 1st or 2nd pick in the draft if he's there. Sometimes though, I can't help but think he's this years' Amobi Okoye. Who's doing ok, but probably not worth all the hype he got.

2. If we were drafting 15th instead of 5th (ish) I would very seriously want us to consider Jahvid Best or even Spiller. At 5 I would agree that it's not really beneficial to us

I don't think I would classify Bradford (or Clausen or Snead or Skelton) as "projects" I mean I don't expect him to tear up the league right away but I could see him starting for us by mid-2010. He won't sit on the bench for three years or anything like that.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

1. Eric Berry is, I think, worth seriously considering at #5 but I'd be surprised if he's there. Suh is great and will probably the 1st or 2nd pick in the draft if he's there. Sometimes though, I can't help but think he's this years' Amobi Okoye. Who's doing ok, but probably not worth all the hype he got.

2. If we were drafting 15th instead of 5th (ish) I would very seriously want us to consider Jahvid Best or even Spiller. At 5 I would agree that it's not really beneficial to us

[3.] I don't think I would classify Bradford (or Clausen or Snead or Skelton) as "projects" I mean I don't expect him to tear up the league right away but I could see him starting for us by mid-2010. He won't sit on the bench for three years or anything like that.

1. The redskins evidently felt the same way about Laron Landry. How's tha t working out for us? He's a baller, but we've not had the best luck drafting defensive backs in the top 10. Laron Landry - picked way to high (in retrospect). Carlos Rogers - picked way to high (in retrospect). Sean Taylor - started right away but itook almost 3 years for him to really start to grasp the NFL game. Thats far too long for a top 10 pick in my opinion. i'm not sure if its just our bad luck, but "stud" college DBs picked high do not seem to generate immediate returns - which should be a "given" when youre picking that high in the draft. Couple that with the fact that FS isn't even one of our top 10 team needs, and you'd have a hard time justifying picking any DB that high.

3. I'm sure they'd all be forced to start and then have matt stratford-esque seasons. No thanks. Give me Leinhart any day of the week instead. He'd come cheaper, be more experiened, and have every bit of upside that Bradford, Claussen, etc. have.

[mlmdub130]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

two things we absolutely should not do with our first round pick are:

1) Draft a defensive player, especially a safety. The move would not fill one of our top 10 team needs and i highly doubt a safety would even be close to being the BPA on the board at 5/6 or wherever we'll be picking.

2) Draft a running back before our offensive line is fixed. Its going to take 2-3 years to really fix our line. Running backs generally are only productive for 5-6 years. so if we draft a running back that high, we're essentially wasting half of his productive career behind a dismal offensive line.

We'd be far better suited to trade UP to get Bradford, Suh, or Okung than we would be to make either of those moves at 5. I even have reservations about drafting a QB at 5. Any player drafted that high should be a day 1 starter and all of the QBs in this years draft are "projects." Not a one of them is NFL ready. If Shanahan is our coach, we'd be FAR better off trading our #2 for Leinhart than using our #1 on Clausen, McCoy or Bradford.

Ideally, i'd love to see us trade Campbell, our #2 (probably around 37 overall), and a conditional 2010 pick to Arizona for Leinhart and Arizona's #2 (probably around 52 overall). Then, try like hell to trade down in the 1st and pick up a 2nd round pick.

We'd have Leinhart and with our first three picks, we'd draft 2 OL and a RB.

so we shouldn't draft a defensive player....but we should trade up for suh???

it is likely that we will have the 5th pick and to say eric berry wouldn't be the bpa for the number five pick is a little bit ruh-tard

i do agree with you on not drafting a running back that early before the line is fixed because their careers are alot shorter these days, but why would you want a qb behind a shitty line especially one like bradford with an injury history

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by mlmdub130

so we shouldn't draft a defensive player....but we should trade up for suh???

That was in reference to drafting Berry. Suh is the best player in the draft period. He'll be better than Haynesworth.

Originally Posted by mlmdub130

it is likely that we will have the 5th pick and to say eric berry wouldn't be the bpa for the number five pick is a little bit ruh-tard

No its not. Read my other post. a college DB may appear to be a really good NFL talent, but we havent had very good luck drafting DBs that high and them playing at an NFL-level right away. Anyone we draft at 5 should not only be a starter right away, but they should also be in pro-bowl consideration their rookie year. They need to make an immediate impact.

Originally Posted by mlmdub130

i do agree with you on not drafting a running back that early before the line is fixed because their careers are alot shorter these days, but why would you want a qb behind a shitty line especially one like bradford with an injury history

I don't. I want Leinhart behind an upgraded offensive line with a 2nd round running back. However, Drafting a QB when you have a bad OL is 1000 times smarter than drafting a RB when you have a bad line:

running backs careers are short. As I stated, we'd be wasting half the RBs career behind a bad line. By contrast, QBs can easily play for 15 years. They also generally take 2-3 years to develop. It actually makes alot of sense to draft a QB before you fix your line and then let him sit on the bench for 2-3 years so that by the time your line is fixed, the QB ready to play. It just doesnt make much sense to draft a QB in the first round when you dont have a good line AND he's not NFL ready. If you're going to select a project QB, it might as well be a later round one. Unless you really think a QB is the next peyton manning, there's not much differnece between a 1st round QB and one taken in the later rounds if theyve both spent 2-3 years on the bench. It really becomes a matter of picking a QB that has the skill set to fit the team's offensive system.

[mlmdub130]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

That was in reference to drafting Berry. Suh is the best player in the draft period. He'll be better than Haynesworth.


No its not. Read my other post. a college DB may appear to be a really good NFL talent, but we havent had very good luck drafting DBs that high and them playing at an NFL-level right away. Anyone we draft at 5 should not only be a starter right away, but they should also be in pro-bowl consideration their rookie year. They need to make an immediate impact.


I don't. I want Leinhart behind an upgraded offensive line with a 2nd round running back. However, Drafting a QB when you have a bad OL is 1000 times smarter than drafting a RB when you have a bad line

running backs careers are short. As I stated, we'd be wasting half the RBs career behind a bad line. By contrast, QBs can easily play for 15 years. They also generally take 2-3 years to develop. It actually makes alot of sense to draft a QB before you fix your line and then let him sit on the bench for 2-3 years so that by the time your line is fixed, the QB ready to play. It just doesnt make much sense to draft a QB in the first round when you dont have a good line AND he's not NFL ready. If you're going to select a project QB, it might as well be a later round one. Unless you really think a QB is the next peyton manning, there's not much differnece between a 1st round QB and one taken in the later rounds if theyve both spent 2-3 years on the bench. It really becomes a matter of picking a QB that has the skill set to fit the team's offensive system.

you can never say that you never truely know 100% that any one player will amount to anything in the nfl

we haven't had much luck doesn't mean much if we is gone and there is a new gm in place. and there are db's that make very smooth transitions to the nfl look at byrd this year and talib last year. in an ideal world it would be grat for all top ten picks to be pro bowlers right away but in the real world we know that is not possible

i agree 100%

again i agree, and imo i don't think any of the qb's coming out will be great starters in the nfl from jump street, there are alot of really good prospects but i wouldn't want any of them jumping behind center on this team next year

doesn't matter what postion it is they need to match our team which is somthing some one didn't used to give a f about, thankfully he is gone

[Redskin Warrior]

I think y'all are missing three draft factors 1. the remaining bowl games 2 the combine & 3 the players pro days. Trust me there will be other players that rise on the draft board

[SmootSmack]

I don't think that a top 5 pick needs to be considered for the pro-bowl their rookie year.

Why do you want Leinart so badly?

How is FS not a top 10 need of ours by the way? Are you splitting up OL five ways?

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I don't think that a top 5 pick needs to be considered for the pro-bowl their rookie year.

Why do you want Leinart so badly?

How is FS not a top 10 need of ours by the way? Are you splitting up OL five ways?

I want Leinart because allegedly Shanahan likes him and i'm not overly impressed with any of the QBs in this years draft.

I would rank our top team needs in a general (but not exact) order as:

OFFENSE:
Left Tackle
Quarterback
Right Tackle
Right Guard
Center
Running Back

DEFENESE (We're likely switching to a 3-4):
Nose Tackle (if Hanyesworth plays DE)
Defensive End (2 DEs if Haynesworth plays NT)
Outside Linebacker (Opposite Orakpo)
1 - 2 Interior Linebackers
Cornerback (one to replace Rogers. 2 if Hall is gone as well)

At that point, we really need a blocking TE a FS, a backup QB and probably another WR and RB. I'd put FS first amongst those needs.

Given the weight i'm placing on all the above needs, combined with the general talent level you get drafting players at positions (you can generally find a better free safety in the 6th round than you can a Nose Tackle, DE, WR, CB, QB, RB etc.), safety is one of the last positions we need to worry about filling in the draft. We also could also consider keeping Smoot and moving him to FS as well. He certainly couldnt play the position any worse than Landry. Free agency could also get us some temporary help there, but i can't imagine any more "waste" of a top 5 pick than a free safety, given all of our other needs.

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I want Leinart because allegedly Shanahan likes him and i'm not overly impressed with any of the QBs in this years draft.

I would rank our top team needs in a general (but not exact) order as:

OFFENSE:
Left Tackle
Quarterback
Right Tackle
Right Guard
Center
Running Back

DEFENESE (We're likely switching to a 3-4):
Nose Tackle (if Hanyesworth plays DE)
Defensive End (2 DEs if Haynesworth plays NT)
Outside Linebacker (Opposite Orakpo)
1 - 2 Interior Linebackers
Cornerback (one to replace Rogers. 2 if Hall is gone as well)

At that point, we really need a blocking TE a FS, a backup QB and probably another WR and RB. I'd put FS first amongst those needs.

Given the weight i'm placing on all the above needs, combined with the general talent level you get drafting players at positions (you can generally find a better free safety in the 6th round than you can a Nose Tackle, DE, WR, CB, QB, RB etc.), safety is one of the last positions we need to worry about filling in the draft. We also could also consider keeping Smoot and moving him to FS as well. He certainly couldnt play the position any worse than Landry. Free agency could also get us some temporary help there, but i can't imagine any more "waste" of a top 5 pick than a free safety, given all of our other needs.

I am just not sure how you put the QB position #2. BOTH tackles are going to need replaced. If you think Heyer is the answer over there, then you are smoking something. Right guard i think Reinhert will be productive. We have the opportunity to get the #1 offensive lineman in the entire draft. If we trade down or stay put, the first pick needs to be an oline man. Campbell with a completely crap oline managed to finish in the middle of the league is basically all statistics. Imagine what the guy could do if he actually had time to throw the ball. Didn't you hear them saying they removed all deep balls from the playbook because of how horrible the line was, come on!! for people to continue to think drafting a QB is the answer are insane. The oline is what is important to this team and any team.
As far as defense, I dont think we are in need of any major upgrades. If we switch to a 3-4, which that isn't a guarantee, we would probably only need an inside guy. I think we have some quality guys that can play in the 3-4. Wilson and Blades can fill in nicely, with Mcintosh, orakpo, and fletcher.

[celts32]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I don't think that a top 5 pick needs to be considered for the pro-bowl their rookie year.

Why do you want Leinart so badly?

How is FS not a top 10 need of ours by the way? Are you splitting up OL five ways?

Didn't you say before on here that Shanahan would target Leinert as his QB? Are you still hearing that? I would like to have him for a low pick but if the Cards are offering him for a low pick that has to make you wonder about what they know that we don't.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by celts32

Didn't you say before on here that Shanahan would target Leinert as his QB? Are you still hearing that? I would like to have him for a low pick but if the Cards are offering him for a low pick that has to make you wonder about what they know that we don't.

Yeah I said Shanahan liked Leinart when he was coming out of college and the rumor was (is?) he might go after him now. No definites though

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Yeah I said Shanahan liked Leinart when he was coming out of college and the rumor was (is?) he might go after him now. No definites though

If Matt Ryan is Matty Ice then Matt Leinart is definitely Matty Lite.



Not saying I wouldn't want him, but his partying habits leave something to be desired.

[MTK]

I wouldn't be against someone like Leinart, but only for a lower round pick. 4th or lower. He hasn't done squat to warrant much else.

[MTK]

DB's typically don't come right in and dominate as rooks. It usually takes a couple of seasons for them to hit their stride. Behind QB, CB is one of the more difficult positions to pick up in the NFL.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

DB's typically don't come right in and dominate as rooks. It usually takes a couple of seasons for them to hit their stride. Behind QB, CB is one of the more difficult positions to pick up in the NFL.

I agree, which is one of the reasons a team with multiple starting needs shouldnt pick one so high in the draft. Its too high a price to pay for someone who won't make an immediate impact.