Would you be ok with...

[Paintrain]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Yeah but Locker is twice the athlete and has a great arm. Hey I agree he's not a guy ready to play until 2012 OR 13 but he's got a huge upside

Even with that, I'm still not sold. If we draft him, I vigorously hope that I am wrong.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Yeah but Locker is twice the athlete and has a great arm. Hey I agree he's not a guy ready to play until 2012 OR 13 but he's got a huge upside

If the lockout, or the current appeal, causes post draft minicamps and OTA's to be canceled and cuts into training camp time then no rookie QB should play this year until at least week 14. Maybe Newton if he goes number 1 but even then they should have a very simple run heavy system in place for him.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Yeah but Locker is twice the athlete and has a great arm. Hey I agree he's not a guy ready to play until 2012 OR 13 but he's got a huge upside

I would argue that Shuler also was a great athlete and had a great arm. Those two qualities alone do not make for NFL success, as Shuler sadly showed.

[skinsfaninok]

Originally Posted by Lotus

I would argue that Shuler also was a great athlete and had a great arm. Those two qualities alone do not make for NFL success, as Shuler sadly showed.

True but I just don't see shuler as the same level of athlete but again that doesn't make a good QB. I like jakes toughness and will to win, Heath didn't have that on the football field IMO .

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Mallett is the most ready to play QB right now, I still think JL will be the Star of the group

It could go either way. On one hand you could say that he played in a pro style system and has an NFL ready arm.

On the other hand you could say that his pro style system has failed to prepare any QB for the NFL level, his decision making is suspect, and he doesn't have the mobility to escape the rush.

He'll have to sit for a year or two if for no other reason then to know where everyone is so his inability to avoid the rush doesn't become a liability.

QB's that are NFL ready usually have some sort of mobility or pocket presence that allows them to buy extra time as they learn to read NFL defenses. Matt Ryan, Big Ben, Flacco, Marino, and Freeman all had at the very least decent mobility. And yes Flacco and Ryan both have decent mobility. Mallet has minimal. Short of being protected by the Jets line he'll be a major liability his first year.

In my mind he's a project.

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Locker has just got Heath Shuler written ALL over him. Mobile, inaccurate, low football IQ. Can't see him all of the sudden becoming a great QB when he never was before.

Personally, for better or worse, I feel that Mike Vick is a better comparison.

[Landry44]

Originally Posted by Dirtbag59

It could go either way. On one hand you could say that he played in a pro style system and has an NFL ready arm.

On the other hand you could say that his pro style system has failed to prepare any QB for the NFL level, his decision making is suspect, and he doesn't have the mobility to escape the rush.

He'll have to sit for a year or two if for no other reason then to know where everyone is so his inability to avoid the rush doesn't become a liability.

QB's that are NFL ready usually have some sort of mobility or pocket presence that allows them to buy extra time as they learn to read NFL defenses. Matt Ryan, Big Ben, Flacco, Marino, and Freeman all had at the very least decent mobility. And yes Flacco and Ryan both have decent mobility. Mallet has minimal. Short of being protected by the Jets line he'll be a major liability his first year.

In my mind he's a project.




Personally, for better or worse, I feel that Mike Vick is a better comparison.

Ryan Mallett has a world class arm. He's extremely accurate with the football. He's proven that he can go through his progressions and make a good decision on a consistent basis. It's obvious that you haven't seen Mallett play because if you did you would know that he's pretty good at avoiding pressure and making big throws. He's play against the best competition and put up big numbers against them. How is this guy a project? Is it because he's not mobile? If so, that's probably one of the most idiotic statements that I've read on here so far. The qbs you named aren't elite qbs even though Big Ben got two rings. However, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Rivers, and Matt Shaub are all very successful and neither one of them are mobile qbs.

[Dirtbag59]

Ironically I never labled Flacco, Ryan, and Ben as elite QB's. What I did say was that they were QB's that were able to contribute right away. They weren't projects. However it's certainly not difficult to make a case for them considering the fact that all three posted 90+ ratings this past year.

Anyway the link between Ryan, Ben, Marino and Flacco was good enough mobility that allowed them to buy an extra second or two in the pocket. Thereby creating a push against their inexperience in reading NFL defensive coverage. I can't think of any pure pocket passer that experienced anywhere near the level of success achieved by the four I mentioned during their rookie season.

Here's more detail on why Mallet qualifies as a project:

- His pro style system has failed to produce one even mediocre QB at the NFL level. In fact the most promising prospect to come through the NFL ranks was cut during training camp (see Brian Brohm, Chris Redman, Stefen LeFors, Dave Ragone).

- Fine he played in an elite conference. It was suppose to help good old Eli take the NFL by storm (that storm took 4 regular seasons to develop) as well as our very own Campbell. Stafford is promising but he certainly didn't post great numbers right away.

- Also if we take away the 3 games where he got to play with a vaunted SEC team against the children of the poor (Tenn Tech, Lou-Monroe, UTEP) his numbers go down from 32 TD passes and 12 Ints to 21 TD passes and 10 ints.

His completion percentage also drops to 62%. Which while accurate doesn't qualify him as extremely accurate. Especially when compared to the 55% and 43% (yes 43%) he posted the previous two years.

- He doesn't have nearly enough mobility to compensate for his lack of knowledge in regards to NFL speed and coverage schemes. So unless he gets the line that protects Brady or the one that protects Sanchez he will see the same level of pressure that he saw against Ohio State.

And the saddest thing about all this is I don't even hate Mallet. In fact I'm intrigued by him as a QB prospect. I don't know if he's right for our system but if our team drafts him I'll surely know the answer. However the only chance he has to develop ahead of the curve is a great O-line. And very few teams have that.

PS - I'll have you know I watched him against UGA, Auburn, Alabama, and Ohio State from start to finish. So please don't play the "you've never watched him play" card.

[Swarley]

Locker also doesn't seem like someone that'll get butt-hurt if things aren't going as planned. He leaves it all on the field because he loves the game.

[irish]

I have no problem with the Skins not taking a QB in this draft.

[IrMitchell]

Absolutely I'd be okay with it.

It's no secret, if you don't like a quarterback enough that you have to draft him past round 1, he's clearly not good enough.

If Shanahan likes Locker or Mallett or who the hell knows, they'll be taken at #10. Anything past that and there's obviously too much doubt or optimism.

[Swarley]

I agree for the most part but that doesn't mean you don't draft a QB late. Our team is starving for a young QB and the Shannys know that.

If I have it my way, we'll pick Pat Devlin late!

[Monkeydad]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

Research shows that 2nd round QBs have been mostly disappointments, so unless you get a top flight guy in the 1st round it's basically a waste to take a QB in later rounds.

I believe research would also show any QB with a horrible O-line is at a nearly insurmountable disadvantage.

Use that 1st-round pick on another O-lineman and a 2nd-round QB will have a better chance at success than a 1st-round QB without the line upgrade.

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by Monkeydad

I believe research would also show any QB with a horrible O-line is at a nearly insurmountable disadvantage.

Use that 1st-round pick on another O-lineman and a 2nd-round QB will have a better chance at success than a 1st-round QB without the line upgrade.

If we keep that second round pick I would much rather use it on a front 7 defender.

And whats to say that our O-Line will be horrible this year? Just because of what happened last year? I saw the Falcons and Chief O-Lines change over the course of one offseason with little if any additions, and even though the Falcons drafted Sam Baker in 08 he still only played 5 games.

We have Trent Williams not to mention a chance to choose between a healthy Jammal Brown and Ryan Harris. Davin Joesph is also a huge favorite to come here. Kory L got a year of starting experience, Will Montgomery is improving, and I'm sure that between Cook and Capers one will develop into a solid starter. Heck even Heyer improved last year into a respectable swing man.

Bottom line we could easily be going into next year with 3 pro bowl level starters (Williams, Brown, Joesph) or at worst 2 pro bowlers and one very good young Right Tackle.

Also don't forget we have plenty of late round picks and Shanahan has made a living out of getting quality lineman in rounds 5-7.

Finally in light of the improved O-Lines I mentioned in KC and ATL we will easily have more raw talent then both of them. Only thing left to do is continue feeding the late round pipeline and getting two top notch guys signed out of Joesph, Brown, and Harris.

[Defensewins]

Originally Posted by Dirtbag59

If we keep that second round pick I would much rather use it on a front 7 defender.

And whats to say that our O-Line will be horrible this year? Just because of what happened last year? I saw the Falcons and Chief O-Lines change over the course of one offseason with little if any additions, and even though the Falcons drafted Sam Baker in 08 he still only played 5 games.

We have Trent Williams not to mention a chance to choose between a healthy Jammal Brown and Ryan Harris. Davin Joesph is also a huge favorite to come here. Kory L got a year of starting experience, Will Montgomery is improving, and I'm sure that between Cook and Capers one will develop into a solid starter. Heck even Heyer improved last year into a respectable swing man.

Bottom line we could easily be going into next year with 3 pro bowl level starters (Williams, Brown, Joesph) or at worst 2 pro bowlers and one very good young Right Tackle.

Also don't forget we have plenty of late round picks and Shanahan has made a living out of getting quality lineman in rounds 5-7.

Finally in light of the improved O-Lines I mentioned in KC and ATL we will easily have more raw talent then both of them. Only thing left to do is continue feeding the late round pipeline and getting two top notch guys signed out of Joesph, Brown, and Harris.

No disrespect intended but you sound like Vinny Ceratto. I looked at last years team stats for another thread and I was shocked at how bad our offensive line played both visually and statically. We were 28th in giving up sacks with 46 sacks. We were 31st (next to last) in our QB taking hits with 110 Qb hits. Keep in the mind the worst team had 111, we were one hit away from being last. We were 30th in the league in rushing yards.
I think it is great that you are optimistic, but our O-line sucks.
That you mentioned Heyer is scary. You can not polish a turd. :cheeky-sm
Seriously though, we need new young linemen.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by Defensewins

No disrespect intended but you sound like Vinny Ceratto. I looked at last years team stats for another thread and I was shocked at how bad our offensive line played both visually and statically. We were 28th in giving up sacks with 46 sacks. We were 31st (next to last) in our QB taking hits with 110 Qb hits. Keep in the mind the worst team had 111, we were one hit away from being last. We were 30th in the league in rushing yards.
I think it is great that you are optimistic, but our O-line sucks.
That you mentioned Heyer is scary. You can not polish a turd. :cheeky-sm
Seriously though, we need new young linemen.

I agree with you but I also wonder how much of the OL problems were from the players learning the zone blocking scheme and trying to utilize it for the first time. Plus the fact the team only had a couple of zone blocking style OL.

In any event the team needs more zone blocking style OL and having been in the scheme for a second year I'm hoping the OL plays better.