There goes the neighborhood - Tunisia Edition

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

Hiroshima was a military target that was chosen because of its industry, naval ports and military headquarters. Not because of its civilian population.
Pretty common knowledge.....

So the civilians weren't there? Imagine this was some afghani saying "the cafe was chosen because military personnel held meetings there." Would that be ok? Because it's the same ****ing thing on an exponentially smaller scale.

[Alvin Walton]

You expected us to go to war with Japan without creating any collateral damage?

Please go read up on a A LOT of history before you respond.

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

You expected us to go to war with Japan without creating any collateral damage?

Please go read up on a A LOT of history before you respond.

It's not "collateral" when it's the primary target. Feel free to read the below definition before you respond.

Collateral Damage
: injury inflicted on something other than an intended target
merriam-webster

[Alvin Walton]

You're either a troll or only 12 years old.
Or possibly you have a dove shoved so far up your a$$ that you have lost connection with reality.

[BleedBurgundy]

Game. Set. Match.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

All true, and I often forget to account for the power of prayer. (Now that's condescending!)

EDIT: duplicate post...see below

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

All true, and I often forget to account for the power of prayer. (Now that's condescending!)

I'm very sorry you've had some sort of bad experiences with over-zealous Christians or something of that nature. I won't change your mind, but I will pray for you.

Hopefully, you will open your mind to accept the fact that although you can find examples of violence in the name of religion, you will find a whole heck of a lot more good that is done by people (of all faiths) in the name of their religion. And most religious folks are genuinely good people.

God Bless.

As far as your issues with U.S. policies, you sound completely ashamed of and disgusted by our country and its actions. If I felt as you appear to, I would renounce my citizenship and find a better place to call home.

[Slingin Sammy 33]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

You're either a troll or only 12 years old.
Or possibly you have a dove shoved so far up your a$$ that you have lost connection with reality.

You can't win with BB. You can make a completely cogent agrument that blows up his angry and incoherent babble and he'll shift to more nonsense about how terrible the U.S. is or it's all Christians' fault.

Your point about him studying some more history is sure to fall on deaf ears, as facts about why the U.S. was brought into WWII, or why we were at odds with the USSR in the first place don't sync-up with his points.

[Alvin Walton]

Ah well...why debate with facts when you can say so much more with off the hip emotion hype......

[That Guy]

yes, because anyone who has an arguement that doesn't agree with your world view is obviously an idiot, a troll, or out of touch.

every major religion and most major powers have done terrible things.

remember, iran was a democracy till the US/UK blew it up for english oil interests in the 1950s. the US put saddam, the taliban, and the shah into power. the allied powers sorta kicked the palestinians out of palestine in the 1940s, so all of this meddling in the ME/SWA has caused some long term problems for us there.

that doesn't mean that we're evil or that muslims are all super violent monsters. a lot of bad sh$% has happened over the years on both sides and the generalizations don't really help.

[Alvin Walton]

I find it amusing when people suggest we should have been more humane to the Japanese while they were trying to conquer the world while slaughtering hundreds of thousands of people.

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33

You can't win with BB. You can make a completely cogent agrument that blows up his angry and incoherent babble and he'll shift to more nonsense about how terrible the U.S. is or it's all Christians' fault.

Your point about him studying some more history is sure to fall on deaf ears, as facts about why the U.S. was brought into WWII, or why we were at odds with the USSR in the first place don't sync-up with his points.

Or, what I'm saying is that when these violent events happen, it's important to realize the underlying causes.

In my opinion, the US has a habit of getting much too involved when it comes to how other nations govern themselves. No only do we stick our national nose where it doesn't belong but we happen to be really bad at it. The end result is that we end up fighting wars to force a system of government on people who, based on results to date, don't want it. (and don't have to want it) There seems to be this thought among some people here that we automatically have the right to engage in the internal affairs of sovereign nations. I disagree. (and please don't point to 9/11 as a blanket justification for any of this - without a shitload of shady actions on the part of the US, the case could be made that there never would have been a 9/11)

Regarding the religion thing, and I'm really trying to be respectful here, the fact that these "terrorists" (talk about a word with an ever broadening definition) happen to believe in a completely different faith then the vast majority of Americans, well, that just makes it so much easier to objectify and pigeon hole them doesn't it? They don't believe in our god or our system of govt? Let's get those ****ing heathens! They need our help, ignorant violent bastards. They really should thank us for coming into their society (which has existed multiple orders of magnitude longer than our own) and forcing leaders who support us into power.

I'm providing a counter point to the above position.

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

I find it amusing when people suggest we should have been more humane to the Japanese while they were trying to conquer the world while slaughtering hundreds of thousands of people.

This is where you are confused. I'm not making any claims a far as right or wrong. What I'm saying is that we don't get to both blow up a couple hundred thousand civilians, justify it militarily, and then play the morality card when others do the exact same thing (on a much smaller scale).

[Alvin Walton]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

This is where you are confused. I'm not making any claims a far as right or wrong. What I'm saying is that we don't get to both blow up a couple hundred thousand civilians, justify it militarily, and then play the morality card when others do the exact same thing (on a much smaller scale).

Yes we do.
And we do it with a proper calling card and uniformed soldiers.
Bin Laden and his buddies changed the rules when they chose to start a conflict anonymously. Any collateral damage is their fault AFAIC.

[HailGreen28]

Originally Posted by BleedBurgundy

This is where you are confused. I'm not making any claims a far as right or wrong. What I'm saying is that we don't get to both blow up a couple hundred thousand civilians, justify it militarily, and then play the morality card when others do the exact same thing (on a much smaller scale).

I was unaware that the US had taken airliners loaded with civilian men, women, and children, and flown them into office buildings of a country that had not declared war on their country. (In fact, we were invited into Saudi Arabia by their government.)

"Exact same thing" indeed. You made a claim of right and wrong, and failed badly at it.