How bad is our secondary?

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Wilson is OK yes but it seems like he's behind his guy more than hall IMO. But of course our whole secondary is really shaky

Okie, I respectfully disagree. I consider Josh Wilson to be a serious baller. Every corner gets beat sometimes but for the most part Wilson is rock solid IMO.

BTW, you jinxed us by going to the game. I hope you had a good time anyway.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Okie, I respectfully disagree. I consider Josh Wilson to be a serious baller. Every corner gets beat sometimes but for the most part Wilson is rock solid IMO.

BTW, you jinxed us by going to the game. I hope you had a good time anyway.

Wilson is a solid #2 and borderline #1 corner IMO. His smallish size probably holds him back more than anything. His instincts and skill level are, as you point out, pretty darn solid.

[skinsfaninok]

Also speaking of secondary, I know I've always talked about Reed and how bad he is but yesterday he was the first player on the field warning up and one of the last one off.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

U guys hate on hall way too much. He's not champ Bailey but He's not a scrub either

Im not calling him a scrub. Just that your post about wislon always getting beat and hall bein good seemed almost sarcastic.

[punch it in]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

Also speaking of secondary, I know I've always talked about Reed and how bad he is but yesterday he was the first player on the field warning up and one of the last one off.

Now can we talk about how bad he is again? Lol

[mooby]

I'm a pretty firm believer that an excellent pass rush can hide even the worst of secondaries, and I think what did us in yesterday was an excellent game plan on the 'Rams side combined with a lack of pass rush on our side. Their game plan was to get the ball out as quick as possible, and it seemed they were prepared for our zone coverages. Bradford never held the ball for long, and even when he did we didn't have a good enough pass rush to make it affect his throws. With Rak and Carriker now out for the season we really need to come up with an effective way to get a pass rush, whether it be unconventional blitzes or whatever, otherwise it will be a long season. If we can't get a rush on the other side of Kerrigan they will be able to double team him for the rest of the season and it will effectively neutralize our pass rush. It seems it's time for Has' to earn his money at d-coordinator, and I'm not terribly enthused given his lack of adjustments in the past.

[imaskin4life]

Originally Posted by mooby

I'm a pretty firm believer that an excellent pass rush can hide even the worst of secondaries, and I think what did us in yesterday was an excellent game plan on the 'Rams side combined with a lack of pass rush on our side. Their game plan was to get the ball out as quick as possible, and it seemed they were prepared for our zone coverages. Bradford never held the ball for long, and even when he did we didn't have a good enough pass rush to make it affect his throws. With Rak and Carriker now out for the season we really need to come up with an effective way to get a pass rush, whether it be unconventional blitzes or whatever, otherwise it will be a long season. If we can't get a rush on the other side of Kerrigan they will be able to double team him for the rest of the season and it will effectively neutralize our pass rush. It seems it's time for Has' to earn his money at d-coordinator, and I'm not terribly enthused given his lack of adjustments in the past.

The problem with the getting a pass rush right now is that the holding penalty goes unnoticed more with the substitute referees. Their backup offensive lineman looked liked pro bowlers on sunday.

I think that we knew going into the game that they would fear our pass rush and would focus on the short pass to move the ball -- which makes it even MORE mind boggling to me that the plan was to play a soft zone coverage as if we were afraid of getting beat deep. I wanted to see our DBs pressing more often in man coverage. ESPECIALLY after amendola's 5th or 6th catch in the first quarter.

[Evilgrin]

Originally Posted by mooby

I'm a pretty firm believer that an excellent pass rush can hide even the worst of secondaries, and I think what did us in yesterday was an excellent game plan on the 'Rams side combined with a lack of pass rush on our side. Their game plan was to get the ball out as quick as possible, and it seemed they were prepared for our zone coverages. Bradford never held the ball for long, and even when he did we didn't have a good enough pass rush to make it affect his throws. With Rak and Carriker now out for the season we really need to come up with an effective way to get a pass rush, whether it be unconventional blitzes or whatever, otherwise it will be a long season. If we can't get a rush on the other side of Kerrigan they will be able to double team him for the rest of the season and it will effectively neutralize our pass rush. It seems it's time for Has' to earn his money at d-coordinator, and I'm not terribly enthused given his lack of adjustments in the past.

They never affected his timing, pushed the pocket in, or changed his throwing lanes. He was way too comfortable all game. I think that was the reason they didn't switch to man, we would have got beaten over the top.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by Evilgrin

They never affected his timing, pushed the pocket in, or changed his throwing lanes. He was way too comfortable all game. I think that was the reason they didn't switch to man, we would have got beaten over the top.

Possibly, but by staying in zone with no pass rush they were still able to effectively move the ball at will.

[los panda]

hopefully we can come to terms w doug dutch. he's a deep sleeper to get the most defense ball gamer for pass throws in english

[SmootSmack]

Barnes is available now

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Barnes is available now

So do we still get our pick from the Loins? Was the deal simply contingent on his being on their week 1 roster?

[The Goat]

^ No.

[jdc65]

I think the secondary can be good if they utilize matchups properly, and play more physical. Playing zone defense, by it's nature, is passive, whereas press-man is aggressive and physical. Getting beat deep is the major problem with press, which is why keeping the safeties back is paramount without shut-down corners.

What I like about C.Griffin is he is a big, physical corner. He matches up well against the big, physical receivers on their schedule like Green, Little, Nicks, Bryant, and Jones among others. Of course, he will need safety help deep as he can't stay with elite receivers, but he can physically handle them on the line. Disrupting patterns and throwing off timing are huge advantages for a defense.

I think Hall in the slot is good as he is able to make plays from there, and isn't tasked with covering #1's. Playing him near the line allows him to blitz or cover running backs when no slot is in.

Wilson is a good matchup for most receivers, except the physical ones, and is as close to a shut down corner as the team has. Why wasn't he on Amendola the whole game is mystifying. Crawford looks like he will be decent in the future, and should see more playing time as the season progresses.

Between Gomes and Meriweather, strong safety looks decent as either can play the run or pass effectively.

Free Safety is a weakness with Williams, but playing a press-man should not allow the free release that gives the offensive player an advantage. I think Williams would be better covering half the field in a cover 2 than playing centerfield. Free safety might be a high priority next year.

The secondary has issues for sure, but I think the coordinators could use them more effectively to achieve better results.

[The Goat]

^ Fantastic post jdc65. I've been wondering if Haslett and Morris both agreed on the ultra soft coverage we saw against STL? Or if Morris would have played it tight man coverage more like the NO game, and Haslett overruled him?