Len Pastabelly on Gibbs' Retirement: "Just An Ordinary Joe"

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

It is kind of surprising we have a whole thread dedicated to his column, but not one on John Clayton's

It's unfair, since John Clayton is so even handed and much more interesting, but Lenny's article made my blood boil.

[BDBohnzie]

Take the article for what it is and move on. There really is no need to dwell on backhanded compliments (which is how I read them) and "I told you so"s. Pastabelly gets paid to write his opinion about football, and while most people do not agree with his opinion, he's entitled to it. It obviously pays the bills because he's still writing for ESPN.

The only thing I don't fully agree with in his article is his lack of gumption in saying "Thankfully, for Gibbs, the Hall of Fame is a lifetime fraternity from which a member can't be expelled." This is completely asinine and unnecessary. Opinion or not, Gibbs' overall track record is quite good. 10 playoff appearances in 16 years (17-7 record, 71% winning percentage), 4 Super Bowl appearances, 3 Lombardi Trophies, 154-94 regular season record (62% winning percentage). Just because Gibbs was not able to live up to anyone's expectations in his 2nd tenure does not mean he still isn't a Hall of Fame coach.

Agree or disagree with records, players, management, etc., the one thing Joe was able to do was right the ship and get the franchise back it's swagger. A swagger that will continue under the next coach and into the future.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by BDBohnzie

Take the article for what it is and move on. There really is no need to dwell on backhanded compliments (which is how I read them) and "I told you so"s. Pastabelly gets paid to write his opinion about football, and while most people do not agree with his opinion, he's entitled to it. It obviously pays the bills because he's still writing for ESPN.

The only thing I don't fully agree with in his article is his lack of gumption in saying "Thankfully, for Gibbs, the Hall of Fame is a lifetime fraternity from which a member can't be expelled." This is completely asinine and unnecessary. Opinion or not, Gibbs' overall track record is quite good. 10 playoff appearances in 16 years (17-7 record, 71% winning percentage), 4 Super Bowl appearances, 3 Lombardi Trophies, 154-94 regular season record (62% winning percentage). Just because Gibbs was not able to live up to anyone's expectations in his 2nd tenure does not mean he still isn't a Hall of Fame coach.

Agree or disagree with records, players, management, etc., the one thing Joe was able to do was right the ship and get the franchise back it's swagger. A swagger that will continue under the next coach and into the future.

That comment rubbed me wrong too.

Even with the past 4 years, you can't deny that his overall resume is Hall worthy. In fact it's not even up for debate. And it's just stupid to try to argue otherwise.

[MTK]

Just an observation: Why do I get the impression that some people don't even both reading through threads before posting... and instead just read the initial post and respond.

Is it just me?

Am I crazy?

Sometimes it seems that people jump in to the conversation midstream and start asking the same questions that have pretty much already been addressed.

[EternalEnigma21]

About the QB play, since it has been brought up:

I seem to recall JC playing pretty stellar in the opening quarter or two of games, and making mistakes when he's asked to turn it back on after we blow a slim lead. I can think of 3 interceptions at the very end of ballgames (2 at dallas and 1 at TB) trying to come back from a blown lead because of conservative play.

I wondered then and now, how he would have fared if his offense didn't change with a lead. Even the players said the gameplan changed and they were allowed to do things with a lead that they should have been doing all along...

[firstdown]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

About the QB play, since it has been brought up:

I seem to recall JC playing pretty stellar in the opening quarter or two of games, and making mistakes when he's asked to turn it back on after we blow a slim lead. I can think of 3 interceptions at the very end of ballgames (2 at dallas and 1 at TB) trying to come back from a blown lead because of conservative play.

I wondered then and now, how he would have fared if his offense didn't change with a lead. Even the players said the gameplan changed and they were allowed to do things with a lead that they should have been doing all along...

Thats a fair question to ask but all QB's in the NFL have to perform in the last minutes of a game. The thing that seperates good QB's from great ones is their ability to pull out a game in the final drive. JC has shown the ability to drive us down the field but not the ability to make that final play. Even if we play the same for the entire game he has to show that he can win these types of games. I'm not saying he cannot but can someone point out a game where he has driven us down field and scored to win a game. I'm not bashing JC I'm just not ready to say that he is our franchise QB.

One other thing on JC.
He seems to get into the rush mode a little soon when we are driving the ball downfield. Like in our first Dallas game he threw a very poor pass to give them the win. We had plenty of time and all he needed to do was throw the ball away.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by canthetuna

About the QB play, since it has been brought up:

I seem to recall JC playing pretty stellar in the opening quarter or two of games, and making mistakes when he's asked to turn it back on after we blow a slim lead. I can think of 3 interceptions at the very end of ballgames (2 at dallas and 1 at TB) trying to come back from a blown lead because of conservative play.

I wondered then and now, how he would have fared if his offense didn't change with a lead. Even the players said the gameplan changed and they were allowed to do things with a lead that they should have been doing all along...

The coaches were only trying to protect their young QB and not put him in bad spots. With a good running game and defense at their disposal it was the logical thing to do.

I think next year we'll see less of that as he continues to gain experience.

[MTK]

LOL there's no barely making the playoffs. You either make it or you don't.

[sancho2613]

ok then if you say the skins "barely made the playoffs twice while he was here". When Gibbs left i bet you would of wished to at least "barely make the playoffs" but you only made it once in what 12 years. Gibbs made it twice in his 4 years. I would say he's not a dissapointment at all especially with what he did just this year alone. I would say the Dolphins coach was a disappointment, maybe you need a coach like that so you can appreciate Gibbs or maybe you want to got to the playoffs just once in the next 12 years? would that be better then going twice in the last 4 years? I think you had a good chance of going to the SB this year how is that not an improvement from making the playoffs just once in 12 years when he was gone?

[BleedBurgundy]

Originally Posted by sancho2613

ok then if you say the skins "barely made the playoffs twice while he was here". When Gibbs left i bet you would of wished to at least "barely make the playoffs" but you only made it once in what 12 years. Gibbs made it twice in his 4 years. I would say he's not a dissapointment at all especially with what he did just this year alone. I would say the Dolphins coach was a disappointment, maybe you need a coach like that so you can appreciate Gibbs or maybe you want to got to the playoffs just once in the next 12 years? would that be better then going twice in the last 4 years? I think you had a good chance of going to the SB this year how is that not an improvement from making the playoffs just once in 12 years when he was gone?

This whole post is perfect. And you're a packer's fan... Positive rep points for you!

[skinsguy]

Honestly Irish, you can make the case for the "other side" all you want, but you and Daseal are vastly outnumbered with this. There is no denying that we only benefited from having Joe Gibbs here.

[SkinEmAll]

I guess the more I read about our two blind, deaf and dumb fellow members,(by the way the blind deaf and dumb remark is not a personal attack, just an observation), My question to myself and everyone else here is.....why bother? Seriously, if these two and anyone else who is in agreement with them, cant see the difference in this team pre and post Gibbs II, well then to hell with em. I almost feel like they are doing it just for attention. I mean can someone really be that, blind, deaf and dumb?

[#56fanatic]

Originally Posted by SkinEmAll

I guess the more I read about our two blind, deaf and dumb fellow members,(by the way the blind deaf and dumb remark is not a personal attack, just an observation), My question to myself and everyone else here is.....why bother? Seriously, if these two and anyone else who is in agreement with them, cant see the difference in this team pre and post Gibbs II, well then to hell with em. I almost feel like they are doing it just for attention. I mean can someone really be that, blind, deaf and dumb?

unbelievable for someone to post this crap. is it seriously needed, brother? Because some people look at the overall win loss record of the proof for change is not wrong.
i look at this two sided. 1 side - we are no better now than when Gibbs first got here 4 years ago. wins and losses ultimately make you or break you in the NFL. Yes we have made the playoffs two of the four years. great!! i love it. however, it took two miracle runs of 5 and 4 in row to go to the playoffs. if we have to make those kind of runs every year to make the playoffs, we may end up on the short end of the stick from time to time. When marty left we were 8-8, when spurrier left he was 12-20 overall, 8 games under 500. when Gibbs left, 5 games under 500. So, honestly wins and losses we are still the same team we were 8 years ago.

side 2. we are better off in terms of chemistry, draft picks for next year (minus a 4th rounder?) younger talent, making the Redskins matter again, making us feel more like a family. we are better off looking at it this way. Hopefully the Danny will learn patience, make the right move with the next coach (GW). if he hires someone else, Carroll, Cowher this roster will likely be blown apart to fit his style and that is 2 or 3 years of moves for us to compete. it all rests on one single move. the head coach. we need continuity, GW or Al is the only way we keep that, hopefully The Danny will realize this.

[SkinEmAll]

Originally Posted by #56fanatic

unbelievable for someone to post this crap. is it seriously needed, brother? Because some people look at the overall win loss record of the proof for change is not wrong.
i look at this two sided. 1 side - we are no better now than when Gibbs first got here 4 years ago. wins and losses ultimately make you or break you in the NFL. Yes we have made the playoffs two of the four years. great!! i love it. however, it took two miracle runs of 5 and 4 in row to go to the playoffs. if we have to make those kind of runs every year to make the playoffs, we may end up on the short end of the stick from time to time. When marty left we were 8-8, when spurrier left he was 12-20 overall, 8 games under 500. when Gibbs left, 5 games under 500. So, honestly wins and losses we are still the same team we were 8 years ago.

side 2. we are better off in terms of chemistry, draft picks for next year (minus a 4th rounder?) younger talent, making the Redskins matter again, making us feel more like a family. we are better off looking at it this way. Hopefully the Danny will learn patience, make the right move with the next coach (GW). if he hires someone else, Carroll, Cowher this roster will likely be blown apart to fit his style and that is 2 or 3 years of moves for us to compete. it all rests on one single move. the head coach. we need continuity, GW or Al is the only way we keep that, hopefully The Danny will realize this.

Well, believe it or not my friend, its just the way I feel. Let me say again, its not a personal attack, just the way I see it. I would hardly call this 'crap' when you consider some of the real 'crap' we all see posted here from time to time. And if you have been following this whole discussion, their are a couple fellow posters who for whatever reason were in some degree of agreement with Len P. and also the win/loss record as their foundation for their arguement. Well to that I say, unbelievable for someone to post this crap. is it seriously needed brother? My whole point is, if you ONLY look at the win/loss record, yes its dissappointing, but you have to look at the Big picture overall to judge Gibbs second term. And if you truly look at that way, theres no way in hell you can agree with fat lenny.

[SmootSmack]

Look, it's one thing to disagree. It's another to call them blind, deaf, and dumb.