Obama Care

[jsarno]

...and then socialism becomes communism.

[Hog1]

This is entertaining..........

YouTube - BOB & TOM TV "Obama Man" by Greg...

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Hog1

This is entertaining..........

YouTube - BOB & TOM TV "Obama Man" by Greg Morton

Very entertaining....I love it!

Obama man makes the world feel good and conservatives feel all mad and acting cad. Obama man is such a bad man, he makes folks wish Ronald Reagan wasn't dead. Too bad, It's all so sad to be a conservative in this great land. Obama man can! Get behind the plan, there's room for one more fan.

Yes he can, man!

[Beemnseven]

Here's John Stossel on Canada's "free" health care system.

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by Beemnseven

Here's John Stossel on Canada's "free" health care system.

This stuck out to me:
In America, people wait in emergency rooms, too, but it's much worse in Canada. If you're sick enough to be admitted, the average wait is 23 hours.

and

More than a million and a half Canadians say they can't find a family doctor. Some towns hold lotteries to determine who gets a doctor.

But while you attempted to educate on the down fall of universal healthcare, I bet your attempts were futile. It really shows us it's a dumb idea, but people just won't listen. It's a shame really. No matter how much you bring that horse to the water, it's still the horses responsibility to drink. Nothing we can do about it.

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by jsarno

This stuck out to me:
In America, people wait in emergency rooms, too, but it's much worse in Canada. If you're sick enough to be admitted, the average wait is 23 hours.

and

More than a million and a half Canadians say they can't find a family doctor. Some towns hold lotteries to determine who gets a doctor.

But while you attempted to educate on the down fall of universal healthcare, I bet your attempts were futile. It really shows us it's a dumb idea, but people just won't listen. It's a shame really. No matter how much you bring that horse to the water, it's still the horses responsibility to drink. Nothing we can do about it.

Yeah, I think most people who favor universal care just look at it from the standpoint that it's one less bill they'll have to pay. Unfortunately, the idea has been fostered for many, many years that medical care is the responsibility of someone else; your employer, or the government -- but certainly not you.

[Beemnseven]

Saden, let me ask you this; and keep in mind, we aren't talking about conservative or liberal viewpoints, this is just plain old common sense -- what happens to the quality of anything thing that is "free" ??

On average, is a public defender as good as an attorney that you pay for out of your own pocket?

Do you know any veterans? Ask any of them what they think of the service they have received at a veterans hospital.

If McDonalds started giving away free Big Macs, what would the lines be like at Mickey D's? And what would happen to the quality of the Big Macs?

Again, forget ideology -- just think about street smarts. You get what you pay for, right?

[budw38]

Originally Posted by saden1

Very entertaining....I love it!

Obama man makes the world feel good and conservatives feel all mad and acting cad. Obama man is such a bad man, he makes folks wish Ronald Reagan wasn't dead. Too bad, It's all so sad to be a conservative in this great land. Obama man can! Get behind the plan, there's room for one more fan.

Yes he can, man!

Happy 4th Saden . Conservatives feel " mad & cad " ,,,, like Liberals werent the last 8 years ? The truth is , 25 years from now , it will be liberal democrats that will suffer the most from Obama/Pelosi policies . Lawyers , IT technichans and dem's with job skills to work in high paying jobs will do fine < as do people along all political lines > , but the lib's who always expect the Gov't to " give " them something will be left with very little ,,, no such thing as a free lunch . I happen to be happy at the moment , I invested some $ in stem cell com and solar stocks after the election and have made some damn nice returns . Happy 4th skins fans !

[saden1]

Originally Posted by budw38

Happy 4th Saden . Conservatives feel " mad & cad " ,,,, like Liberals werent the last 8 years ? The truth is , 25 years from now , it will be liberal democrats that will suffer the most from Obama/Pelosi policies . Lawyers , IT technichans and dem's with job skills to work in high paying jobs will do fine < as do people along all political lines > , but the lib's who always expect the Gov't to " give " them something will be left with very little ,,, no such thing as a free lunch . I happen to be happy at the moment , I invested some $ in stem cell com and solar stocks after the election and have made some damn nice returns . Happy 4th skins fans !

You too man...Happy 4th of July.

I ain't gonna lie, I was mad but I got over it. I think we'll be alright.

[saden1]

Hello folks,

This Canadian doctor shortage isn't due to universal healthcare but many factors. Canada is suffering from medical practitioners shortage just as we are from nursing shortage. It just so happens ours isn't as pronounced yet. Please believe this is going to be a problem for us going forward whether we have or don't have universal healthcare. Play "Spot the Foreigner" next time you're at the doctor's office. Also, a friend of mines mother lives in the boondocks and she has to travel 2.5 hours to Seattle to see a doctor so I wonder if I can blame this on the current system.

For **** sake people, you guys are smarter than this.

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by saden1

Hello folks,

This Canadian doctor shortage isn't due to universal healthcare but many factors. Canada is suffering from medical practitioners shortage just as we are from nursing shortage. It just so happens ours isn't as pronounced yet. Please believe this is going to be a problem for us going forward whether we have or don't have universal healthcare. Play "Spot the Foreigner" next time you're at the doctor's office. Also, a friend of mines mother lives in the boondocks and she has to travel 2.5 hours to Seattle to see a doctor so I wonder if I can blame this on the current system.

For **** sake people, you guys are smarter than this.

Try giving nearly 50 million more Americans insurance in a short time span and watch how quickly it becomes pronounced.

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Try giving nearly 50 million more Americans insurance in a short time span and watch how quickly it becomes pronounced.

I generally love your posts GM (even though I am obviously to the left of you, your reasoning is sound and your command of your mother language impressive) but this is an absurd argument. If you are implying that we should keep a large number of people uninsured so as to protect the quality of care for those that do have it, and I think that you are, well I mean, that's a pretty unpalatable position to take.

And First, well it is true that the MA plan is rife with problems, you need to get something straight - it was universally derided by the left as a give away to the insurance companies, a cop out compromise by Romney and company that would do nothing to control costs (which it hasn't). So its failures do not represent the last word on health care reform.

And Beems, there are plenty of services that we give away for free in this country that still manage to be high quality. Had your house catch on fire recently?

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by djnemo65

I generally love your posts GM (even though I am obviously to the left of you, your reasoning is sound and your command of your mother language impressive) but this is an absurd argument. If you are implying that we should keep a large number of people uninsured so as to protect the quality of care for those that do have it, and I think that you are, well I mean, that's a pretty unpalatable position to take.

And First, well it is true that the MA plan is rife with problems, you need to get something straight - it was universally derided by the left as a give away to the insurance companies, a cop out compromise by Romney and company that would do nothing to control costs (which it hasn't). So its failures do not represent the last word on health care reform.

And Beems, there are plenty of services that we give away for free in this country that still manage to be high quality. Had your house catch on fire recently?

Not what I'm saying at all. Saden's comment that I bolded in my response was about how Canada is visibly suffering from a shortage of medical practitioners, similar to how here in the USA we have a big shortage of nurses. However that nursing shortage, according to Saden, isn't as pronounced as Canada's practitioner shortage. I agree with that.

My point was our nursing shortage will certainly be much more "pronounced" under Obama care than it currently is today. Nowhere did I say we should keep 50 million people without insurance simply to stave off the pronouncement of said shortage.

EDIT: There are numerous reasons I dislike Obama care. The dilution of quality of care is just one of them.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Not what I'm saying at all. Saden's comment that I bolded in my response was about how Canada is visibly suffering from a shortage of medical practitioners, similar to how here in the USA we have a big shortage of nurses. However that nursing shortage, according to Saden, isn't as pronounced as Canada's practitioner shortage. I agree with that.

My point was our nursing shortage will certainly be much more "pronounced" under Obama care than it currently is today. Nowhere did I say we should keep 50 million people without insurance simply to stave off the pronouncement of said shortage.

EDIT: There are numerous reasons I dislike Obama care. The dilution of quality of care is just one of them.

What I am also saying is that sometime in the next decade or two the United States will also have doctor shortage much like the current nursing shortage if not worse. It will be pronounced and painful whether we have mostly a private healthcare system or mostly a public healthcare system. Regardless of what we have it doesn't look good (a must read).

[djnemo65]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Not what I'm saying at all. Saden's comment that I bolded in my response was about how Canada is visibly suffering from a shortage of medical practitioners, similar to how here in the USA we have a big shortage of nurses. However that nursing shortage, according to Saden, isn't as pronounced as Canada's practitioner shortage. I agree with that.

My point was our nursing shortage will certainly be much more "pronounced" under Obama care than it currently is today. Nowhere did I say we should keep 50 million people without insurance simply to stave off the pronouncement of said shortage.

EDIT: There are numerous reasons I dislike Obama care. The dilution of quality of care is just one of them.

OK, but this means that you are saying that we should limit access to care for these 50 million people without insurance, at least in part, to protect the quality of care for people with insurance. You can't claim dilution of quality care as a disadvantage of the plan without at least implicitly advocating the status quo.