I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!

[The Goat]

Mack is strictly a G/C prospect in the NFL correct?

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by The Goat

Mack is strictly a G/C prospect in the NFL correct?

Yeah, I'd say that's about right.

I'm sure he could handle RT, but my response would be "why?" That's just not where his true value is.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Yeah, I'd say that's about right.

I'm sure he could handle RT, but my response would be "why?" That's just not where his true value is.

I agree. Why play him away from where he excells? That's the same problem I would have with taking Rey-Rey to play OLB.

[dall-assblows]

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[The Goat]

If we take Mack @ 13 cuz all the OT, DE talent and Rey are off the board we still have to address RT in FA... probably an overpaid, high quality vet (preferably under 30) cut from another franchise. It would mean for one hell of an o-line and I just can't complain about that; however, we're left w/ some pretty serious questions defensively. I doubt there will ever be much LB talent available in FA this year... mainly because there isn't an abundance of LB talent in the draft for teams to replace their expensive vets. Sure we could take an OLB in the 3rd round but then we likely pass on Sidbury completely cuz he'll be gone by the time we're on the clock again... i'd hate to see us pass on that kid and obviously we're due for a talented upgrade at LDE anyway. My bottom line is the safer move in the doomsday scenario probably means taking Clay Matthews or maybe English. It's really no more of a stretch than taking Mack at 13 and at least we have a guy to fill an immediate need on defense at LB.

... like I said no matter what I think we end up w/ an upgrade at RT by start of OTAs, so we've upgraded 2 spots on the o-line this year. That's a blessing... a third upgrade would be the cherry on top but for me it can't supersede the issue at OLB.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by The Goat

If we take Mack @ 13 cuz all the OT, DE talent and Rey are off the board we still have to address RT in FA... probably an overpaid, high quality vet (preferably under 30) cut from another franchise. It would mean for one hell of an o-line and I just can't complain about that; however, we're left w/ some pretty serious questions defensively. I doubt there will ever be much LB talent available in FA this year... mainly because there isn't an abundance of LB talent in the draft for teams to replace their expensive vets. Sure we could take an OLB in the 3rd round but then we likely pass on Sidbury completely cuz he'll be gone by the time we're on the clock again... i'd hate to see us pass on that kid and obviously we're due for a talented upgrade at LDE anyway. My bottom line is the safer move in the doomsday scenario probably means taking Clay Matthews or maybe English. It's really no more of a stretch than taking Mack at 13 and at least we have a guy to fill an immediate need on defense at LB.

... like I said no matter what I think we end up w/ an upgrade at RT by start of OTAs, so we've upgraded 2 spots on the o-line this year. That's a blessing... a third upgrade would be the cherry on top but for me it can't supersede the issue at OLB.

Well damnit Goat, call Vinny and get Marcus back.

[The Goat]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

Well damnit Goat, call Vinny and get Marcus back.

Oh man if we could get Marcus back that would put a lot of concerns to rest. My intuition is Marcus won't come back though even if we offered him a nice 2 year contract...

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by The Goat

If we take Mack @ 13 cuz all the OT, DE talent and Rey are off the board we still have to address RT in FA... probably an overpaid, high quality vet (preferably under 30) cut from another franchise. It would mean for one hell of an o-line and I just can't complain about that; however, we're left w/ some pretty serious questions defensively. I doubt there will ever be much LB talent available in FA this year... mainly because there isn't an abundance of LB talent in the draft for teams to replace their expensive vets. Sure we could take an OLB in the 3rd round but then we likely pass on Sidbury completely cuz he'll be gone by the time we're on the clock again... i'd hate to see us pass on that kid and obviously we're due for a talented upgrade at LDE anyway. My bottom line is the safer move in the doomsday scenario probably means taking Clay Matthews or maybe English. It's really no more of a stretch than taking Mack at 13 and at least we have a guy to fill an immediate need on defense at LB.

... like I said no matter what I think we end up w/ an upgrade at RT by start of OTAs, so we've upgraded 2 spots on the o-line this year. That's a blessing... a third upgrade would be the cherry on top but for me it can't supersede the issue at OLB.

Well, the line would be significantly improved over last year, so Jansen/Heyer could battle it out and the winner would be the de-facto "weak-link" of the line, however, the overall product is still significantly better.

We would have to find some sort of a backup LT though. Couldn't have a situation where both Heyer AND Jansen are on the field.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

Well, the line would be significantly improved over last year, so Jansen/Heyer could battle it out and the winner would be the de-facto "weak-link" of the line, however, the overall product is still significantly better.

We would have to find some sort of a backup LT though. Couldn't have a situation where both Heyer AND Jansen are on the field.

I think this is probably what I've been getting at. In no way do I think Mack is the only player who would improve our team. J. Smith, E. Monroe, M. Oher, A. Curry, R. Maualuga, T. Jackson, P. Jerry and others would be a big help and a tremendous upgrade to us. Our biggest problem was our o-line last year. By far. I just happen to think a player like Mack only comes around once in a great while. I also believe that Mack at center, even with Heyer or Jansen at RT, would benefit our line greater than having Rabach at center and an allpro at RT. We had no pocket last year. That came from pressure from the middle of the line. Remember all the "Why doesn't Zorn put in plays for J.C. to roll out"? complaints? We also could'nt run up the middle. How many times did we try to get short yardage and fail because we could'nt open any holes up the middle? If you can't stop pressure up the middle, most of the time you'll be running for your life. That's why Haynesworth was such a big deal to get. He brings pressure up the middle. I think Mack could help us more than just about any player out there. But by no means do I think he's the only one who could help our team. Hey I'm open to anyone who can help the Redskins. I just think Mack could change what this offense could do in a big way. Would he be my favorite player if he were on the Redskins? I doubt it. I'm a defense kind of guy. Linebackers in particular. Hence the 53Fan. But I can tell you I'd hate to play across from this big, aggressive SOB. And he's in the second level quite a bit. Hail Redskins!!!

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

I think this is probably what I've been getting at. In no way do I think Mack is the only player who would improve our team. J. Smith, E. Monroe, M. Oher, A. Curry, R. Maualuga, T. Jackson, P. Jerry and others would be a big help and a tremendous upgrade to us. Our biggest problem was our o-line last year. By far. I just happen to think a player like Mack only comes around once in a great while. I also believe that Mack at center, even with Heyer or Jansen at RT, would benefit our line greater than having Rabach at center and an allpro at RT. We had no pocket last year. That came from pressure from the middle of the line. Remember all the "Why doesn't Zorn put in plays for J.C. to roll out"? complaints? We also could'nt run up the middle. How many times did we try to get short yardage and fail because we could'nt open any holes up the middle? If you can't stop pressure up the middle, most of the time you'll be running for your life. That's why Haynesworth was such a big deal to get. He brings pressure up the middle. I think Mack could help us more than just about any player out there. But by no means do I think he's the only one who could help our team. Hey I'm open to anyone who can help the Redskins. I just think Mack could change what this offense could do in a big way. Would he be my favorite player if he were on the Redskins? I doubt it. I'm a defense kind of guy. Linebackers in particular. Hense the 53Fan. But I can tell you I'd hate to play across from this big, aggressive SOB. And he's in the second level quite a bit. Hail Redskins!!!

I'm sorry but I wouldn't put Mack in a category of the type of player that "only comes around once in a great while".

And I disagree that having Mack at center with Heyer/Jansen at RT is greater than having Rabach and an All-Pro at RT. First, Heyer/Jansen were the weak link out of all of starting offensive linemen, by far - and maybe the weak link from the entire team - that's a big negative at such a very important position, especially on the line. Their play (or lack of it) was a major reason why the redskins collapsed in the second half of the season. I couldn't say that about Rabach.

Second, there's a reason why Centers have a lower value than offensive tackles - tackles are expected and required to do more on a team than are centers. Hence the low grades for #1 centers than compared to #1 Right or Left tackles in any draft.

[53Fan]

Dude I'm not trying to convince you of anything. What category you put Mack in or I put Mack in, is just a matter of opinion and that's all it is. If you do your homework you'll see that many scouts think he is the best center to come out of the draft in years. There is a reason that Mack, a center, is being talked about as a first round pick. That's why I say a player like this only comes around once in a great while. Like Matt Birk, you don't find too many as good as he is at his position. I think you could say there was more than one weak link on this line last year. For THIS team I think Mack would be a bigger help. That's my opinion. Aren't you the same guy who said Mathews wasn't first round talent but had seen very little film of him? That's part of player analysis you talked about in another thread. If you don't think Rabach and the middle of our line was part of the collapse last year...well I just don't know what to tell you. We'll just agree to disagree about Mack and how much he can help this team. Alex Mack Scouting Report - 2009 NFL Draft Prospect

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

Dude I'm not trying to convince you of anything. What category you put Mack in or I put Mack in, is just a matter of opinion and that's all it is. If you do your homework you'll see that many scouts think he is the best center to come out of the draft in years. There is a reason that Mack, a center, is being talked about as a first round pick. That's why I say a player like this only comes around once in a great while. Like Matt Birk, you don't find too many as good as he is at his position. I think you could say there was more than one weak link on this line last year. For THIS team I think Mack would be a bigger help. That's my opinion. Aren't you the same guy who said Mathews wasn't first round talent but had seen very little film of him? That's part of player analysis you talked about in another thread. If you don't think Rabach and the middle of our line was part of the collapse last year...well I just don't know what to tell you. We'll just agree to disagree about Mack and how much he can help this team. Alex Mack Scouting Report - 2009 NFL Draft Prospect

This discussion isn't about me against you or about me against Mack. I think Mack is also a great player, but there's no reason to ignore his weaknesses to build him up. And in the same way, you also cannot ignore the weaknesses on the redskins. The weakness for the redskins last year was the offensive unit, more specifically, the offensive line; and more specific than that, the right tackle spot. Rabach was the least of the redskins worries on the offensive line last season, considering the injuries and the play of both Heyer and Jansen.

And about Clay Matthews, I could be wrong about him (so-called experts are wrong all the time). But I've seen enough of him to know that this guy is one dimensional. If you want to have a discussion to support that he's a first rounder; that's fine, but if you want to argue with me about how much film i've watched of him - don't do it.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

This discussion isn't about me against you or about me against Mack. I think Mack is also a great player, but there's no reason to ignore his weaknesses to build him up. And in the same way, you also cannot ignore the weaknesses on the redskins. The weakness for the redskins last year was the offensive unit, more specifically, the offensive line; and more specific than that, the right tackle spot. Rabach was the least of the redskins worries on the offensive line last season, considering the injuries and the play of both Heyer and Jansen.

I can confidently say that you don't know what you are talking about, re: OL issues. We have a bunch of problems on the right side of the line and need the best and quickest solution that we can get, be that Mack or someone else.

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I can confidently say that you don't know what you are talking about, re: OL issues. We have a bunch of problems on the right side of the line and need the best and quickest solution that we can get, be that Mack or someone else.

Whatever. I can confidently say you don't know jack.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Whatever. I can confidently say you don't know jack.

Right, but my long posts here usually 1) have a point, and 2) usually rely on some reasoning, and not hearsay. I wish not to know jack about the hearsay that's out there.