Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;572480]The play of the offensive line should improve and I think Haynesworth is likely making the unit look worse than it is, but I'm pretty concerned about the offense. Samuels, Rabach, and Thomas are old, Thomas and Samuels are coming off of injuries,[B] and I don't trust a healthy Heyer to protect JC. Hopefully, we find someone who can come in and play RT for a year or until we find a better, long-term replacement for Jansen.[/B][/quote]

SGG, I agree. It is of concern that we have so many areas of potential concern up front. Certainly RT is a BIG one, I don't think Heyer is ready to start in this league at this time, he's a work in progress.

It also, doesn't appear Mike Williams will be ready for a while to make this great come back if at all.

Maybe Jeremy Bridges can fill the RT spot? When we picked him up I thought good Guard depth or maybe a challenger for Thomas given his health status. I know he has some Tackle experience, might want to see what he can do. Or make a move and pick up a Tackle.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

At this point I'd rather have Kendall than Thomas. This o-line has me concerned. If this team doesn't have a good year it will not be because of the defense, WRs, running game, coaches, or the QB; It will be because of the FO not drafting good OL men. I'm taking a wait and see approach and I hope my fears are groundless for Z, Soup, and the team's sake.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

NFL.com's Jason La Canfora reports that free agent OT Levi Jones is drawing interest from "several teams."

La Canfora isn't specific about these teams, so we're assuming the report was driven by Jones' agent. Jones wants a surefire starting job, but probably won't get one. He's only been linked to the Cardinals since Cincy cut him.
[COLOR="DarkRed"]
Im almost sure the Redskins are one of the teams talking to his agent....................[/COLOR]

Re: Heyer Injured
 

A few questions and thoughts about our Offensive Line:

- When I went to the Redskins training camp, our OL looked awful. I mean as soon as that ball was snapped, the line quickly turned into a circle around JC. Last year, for who ever went to our training camp, did our OL get manhandled as much as the are now?

- Why don't we move BIG Mike Williams in at guard? He is huge, and has more pass protection help than he does at right tackle. Because I don't think he's going to be a RT in the NFL. He just gets beat a lot by our pass rushers.

-Lets just go ahead and sign Levi Jones. He is a pro bowler, his knees should be healthy, and he is a starter at LT, so I could only assume that he'll do fine at RT. He's better than a good amount of the OLineman we have now, anyway.

-Is Jeremey Bridges working at guard or tackle, and is he getting good reviews from the coaches or is he being considered to start anywhere for us this year, because I have a hunch that Randy Thomas could be one of those surprise cuts for us, since he is dealing with two major operations on his neck and knee. And for Bridge's case, he was a starter for Carolina's OL that was one of the best rushing teams in the league.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

I think a fair assessment is that Heyer is injury prone and probably a slow healer. In '07 when he got playing time cuz of injuries I remember he ended up nursing a hamstring/groin pull that made him even less effective than otherwise. I think his performance in the playoff game against Seattle, facing Kearney, was the worst I saw by an olineman all year. Then last year he got hurt pretty quickly as well and the injury just seemed to nag him on and on. In short the FO is irresponsible IMHO to keep relying on a guy w/ Heyer's talent level/track record. I really, really hope Bridges or Williams steps up big between now and opening day...or we go out and spend some money at the position.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

Heyer bruised his knee in a pileup? We should definitely cut him!

Re: Heyer Injured
 

the skins might just be waiting for some players to be cut from other teams before they sign anyone.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

The OLine needs to be healthy, and we need it to be successful. I know this.

But lets remember that these guys did not suffer season ending injuries. The O/D Lines are physical. Philly lost their starting MLB, Carolina has lost a starting DLine guy. All the bodies are getting re-acquainted to the force of the NFL game. The fact that our guys are coming out before the hurt becomes a season ending tear is a far better choice to me. Do I want to see them out there pounding heck yeah, but if sitting out during these dog days lets their muscles and bodies re-set for the season then ok.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=53Fan;572521]Heyer bruised his knee in a pileup? We should definitely cut him![/quote]


i know, right. :doh:

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;572523]The OLine needs to be healthy, and we need it to be successful. I know this.

But lets remember that these guys did not suffer season ending injuries. The O/D Lines are physical. Philly lost their starting MLB, Carolina has lost a starting DLine guy. All the bodies are getting re-acquainted to the force of the NFL game. The fact that our guys are coming out before the hurt becomes a season ending tear is a far better choice to me. Do I want to see them out there pounding heck yeah, but if sitting out during these dog days lets their muscles and bodies re-set for the season then ok.[/quote]

Exactly. Half the guys sitting would still be playing if this were the regular season, but it's not. Why make it worse before the season even starts? After last year it's easy and understandable to get worried, but as Zorn has said, these are TC setbacks, not season setbacks.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=CultBrennan59;572518]A few questions and thoughts about our Offensive Line:

- When I went to the Redskins training camp, our OL looked awful. I mean as soon as that ball was snapped, the line quickly turned into a circle around JC. Last year, for who ever went to our training camp, did our OL get manhandled as much as the are now?

[B]- Why don't we move BIG Mike Williams in at guard?[/B] He is huge, and has more pass protection help than he does at right tackle. Because I don't think he's going to be a RT in the NFL. He just gets beat a lot by our pass rushers.

-Lets just go ahead and sign Levi Jones. He is a pro bowler, his knees should be healthy, and he is a starter at LT, so I could only assume that he'll do fine at RT. He's better than a good amount of the OLineman we have now, anyway.

[B]-Is Jeremey Bridges working at guard or tackle, and is he getting good reviews from the coaches or is he being considered to start anywhere for us this year, because I have a hunch that Randy Thomas could be one of those surprise cuts for us, since he is dealing with two major operations on his neck and knee. And for Bridge's case, he was a starter for Carolina's OL that was one of the best rushing teams in the league[/B].[/quote]

Because hes not a guard. Remember he was a first round draft pick in 02, 4th overall as a Tackle. He has never played at the guard position in the NFL. And he's working out the wrinkles now, this guy has done well, losing the weight and all. But it remains to be seen whether he can even still play at this level and have some kind of miracle comeback. I hope he can challenge at the Tackle spot or at least be solid depth.

And I certainly hope we will have Thomas and Dock ready to roll by the time the season gets going.

Secondly, I believe Bridges is getting action at Guard and Tackle. Never know sounds like he is doing well, could be a nice pick up.

Randy Thomas is going nowhere.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=skinsfan_nn;572534]Because hes not a guard. Remember he was a first round draft pick in 02, 4th overall as a Tackle. He has never played at the guard position in the NFL. And he's working out the wrinkles now, this guy has done well, losing the weight and all. But it remains to be seen whether he can even still play at this level and have some kind of miracle comeback. I hope he can challenge at the Tackle spot or at least be solid depth.

And I certainly hope we will have Thomas and Dock ready to roll by the time the season gets going.

Secondly, I believe Bridges is getting action at Guard and Tackle. Never know sounds like he is doing well, could be a nice pick up.

[B]Randy Thomas is going nowhere[/B].[/quote]

There is no QUIT in Mr. Thomas. The only way he doesn't play this year would be because of injury. To cut him would be ridiculous.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

I'm not suprised,
The D line is now huge up the middle and very speedy on the ends.
It is no suprise these guy need to lunge outside and get pushed around inside
I hope our Dline doesnt contribute to our fragile Oline's injury problems this year.

But if the Dline doesn't kill them first....they will get better

Re: Heyer Injured
 

Did you guys see that Zorn thinks Williams may not be able to run for 3-6 weeks?
Even if it aint serious...this guy needed a full blown preseason to have any shot at starting..let alone becoming a solid backup.
I hope thats just a bunch of crap.
Its a pulled groin...I know that takes some time...but c'mon man...2 weeks on and off should be fine if the guy really wants the RT spot.
Suck it up Fatty Boomballatty!

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=skinsnut;572568]Did you guys see that Zorn thinks Williams may not be able to run for 3-6 weeks?
Even if it aint serious...this guy needed a full blown preseason to have any shot at starting..let alone becoming a solid backup.
I hope thats just a bunch of crap.
Its a pulled groin...I know that takes some time...but c'mon man...2 weeks on and off should be fine if the guy really wants the RT spot.
Suck it up Fatty Boomballatty![/quote]

wasnt the 3-6 weeks remark about roydell williams (broken finger), not mike? maybe i was confused.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=johno;572570]wasnt the 3-6 weeks remark about roydell williams (broken finger), not mike? maybe i was confused.[/quote]

yes it was

Big Mike's injury is nothing serious

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=johno;572570]wasnt the 3-6 weeks remark about roydell williams (broken finger), not mike? maybe i was confused.[/quote]

You are right, my bad...there are too many damn Williams' on this team.
He was talking about Roydell Williams....
On the other hand, I am really hoping "slim" starts making some progress at RT, cause we obviously are depending on that gamble to pan out,

Re: Heyer Injured
 

I think that getting a free agent tackle would be a smart move, especially one of L. Jones' stature. I also think that sighning Kendall for depth would be a good idea. I am all for "coaching them up" but if we want to legitimately compete in this division this year we can't leave the most important component of the offense to chance.

Campbell needs a fair shake before they run him out of town.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;572579]I think that getting a free agent tackle would be a smart move, especially one of L. Jones' stature. I also think that sighning Kendall for depth would be a good idea. I am all for "coaching them up" but if we want to legitimately compete in this division this year we can't leave the most important component of the offense to chance.

Campbell needs a fair shake before they run him out of town.[/quote]

Levi Jones wants to be a starter and get starter's money. Unless Heyer's injury is very serious, I doubt the team or Levi will show any interest.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Ruhskins;572580]Levi Jones wants to be a starter and get starter's money. Unless Heyer's injury is very serious, I doubt the team or Levi will show any interest.[/quote]

You don't think he could beat out Heyer? Give him a one year deal. Obviously no one is beating down his door.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;572583]You don't think he could beat out Heyer? Give him a one year deal. Obviously no one is beating down his door.[/quote]

I wasn't saying that he couldn't beat out Heyer, it is just that Levi probably wants to be in a position where he can be the starter and get starter money. Right now there's a competition for the RT position, with Heyer. I think the Redskins would need to convince Jones that he could be a starter in order to get him interested; not what people are saying that we should get him as a back up. I would love to have Jones here, I just don't think he's going to be interested in us unless a.) Heyer is out and he could come in and start or b.) no one picks him up and we become the best option for him.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Ruhskins;572580]Levi Jones wants to be a starter and get starter's money. Unless Heyer's injury is very serious, I doubt the team or Levi will show any interest.[/quote]

Zorn told the press that we are going to head into the season with linemen currently on our roster. If Heyer or another lineman goes down, I can see us making a move, but I agree that we probably won't sign another starting caliber lineman.

That said, I wish we would sign another lineman like Jones. I just don't trust the guys on the roster in pass protection. I really believe that Campbell could be a very effective quarterback if given the time to make throws. Unfortunately, our current linemen are unlikely to afford him a decent amount of time to throw from the pocket. That fact, when combined with Campbell's slow release, is likely to spell serious trouble.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Ruhskins;572586]I wasn't saying that he couldn't beat out Heyer, it is just that Levi probably wants to be in a position where he can be the starter and get starter money. Right now there's a competition for the RT position, with Heyer. I think the Redskins would need to convince Jones that he could be a starter in order to get him interested; not what people are saying that we should get him as a back up. I would love to have Jones here, I just don't think he's going to be interested in us unless a.) Heyer is out and he could come in and start or b.) no one picks him up and we become the best option for him.[/quote]


It wouldn't be a competition if we signed him. They were hoping that a 450 pounder off the street could push Heyer.

Our line was and is in trouble and I think they need to sign proven talent now before it is too late.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

In the SI article Zorn admits he couldn't call deep route bc JC wasn't getting enough time. That is the coach saying our Oline sucks.

Any tweak is bad news for our line.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=hooskins;572589]In the SI article Zorn admits he couldn't call deep route bc JC wasn't getting enough time. That is the coach saying our Oline sucks.

Any tweak is bad news for our line.[/quote]


Our line is in big trouble at the moment. Someone might say this is jumping the gun, I would tell them to look at the last 8 games from last year...

Re: Heyer Injured
 

I would like if they got Levi Jones too, but let's find out what's up with Heyer before we jump the gun. We have Jeremy Bridges too, and I don't want for the team to overreact and overpay someone like Jones. I mean there has got to be a reason why he hasn't been picked up too.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

Jones would be a good addition but it probably couldn't happen until tc is halfway or more through. If I am Jones, as much as I want to play. I also want to see what teams need me. Just in our division, flozell and samuels are "old", peters and andrews are also battlingg injuries and we have heyer and williams(mike) as the main rt candidates. That's 3 out of 4 teams that in the next week could suddenly turn a deal with him. At this point it only makes sense to wait a couple more days and see what other options might arise. And from the skins view, we are only a couple days in, these lineman are who they thought they were, now let's see what we can accomplish by the time we play baltimore.

All is good folks, let's not throw up our hands before the first kickoff of the season.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;572590]Our line is in big trouble at the moment. Someone might say this is jumping the gun, I would tell them to look at the last 8 games from last year...[/quote]

Boy, I am really tired of the constant reference to the last 8 games as if the first 8 didn't mean anything and also as if this is the same group that hobbled to the finish line. Jansen is gone . Kendall, who took nearly every Wednesday off is gone, samuels is lean mean and determined, Dockery is his able bodied sidekick ready to fend off the dastardly advances of the evil doers in dallas philly ny or any other place that evil opponents may raise their heads. In the first 8 games we ran over teams, without samuels healthy and facing the top 1,2, 3, 5,8,etc defenses in a row we got run over. Its a NEW season, JZ understands better the wear and tear aspect and is leading this team onward. Please let's all agree that last season is over and the new one just begun. Look to the positives throughout camp, trust the koolaid is not spiked.

Thank you for your time, u may now return to ur regularly scheduled worry and disillusionment with our team.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;572598]Boy, I am really tired of the constant reference to the last 8 games as if the first 8 didn't mean anything and also as if this is the same group that hobbled to the finish line. Jansen is gone . Kendall, who took nearly every Wednesday off is gone, samuels is lean mean and determined, Dockery is his able bodied sidekick ready to fend off the dastardly advances of the evil doers in dallas philly ny or any other place that evil opponents may raise their heads. In the first 8 games we ran over teams, without samuels healthy and facing the top 1,2, 3, 5,8,etc defenses in a row we got run over. Its a NEW season, JZ understands better the wear and tear aspect and is leading this team onward. Please let's all agree that last season is over and the new one just begun. Look to the positives throughout camp, trust the koolaid is not spiked.

Thank you for your time, u may now return to ur regularly scheduled worry and disillusionment with our team.[/quote]

Great post. I know that I'm the one that drinks the Kool-Aid all the time and is overly positive about the team, but come on people, it's like this site needs prozac or vicodin. Every little fart of an injury and people think the team is doomed. Have you guys taken a look around the league? There are several guys who are lost for the season. I believe it is Jax and Carolina who just lost start offensive linemen, not little knee tweaks, they are gone. People forget that this type of overreaction is what landed TJ Duckett and Jason Taylor at the expense of picks.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;572583]You don't think he could beat out Heyer? Give him a one year deal. Obviously no one is beating down his door.[/quote]

Two weeks ago Levi Jones said he wouldn't sign anywhere until camps started. I heard a number of teams were interested and the Redskins had not shown any interest as of yet. I hope we pick somebody up, Jones is at the top of the list, but I would be happy with anybody with any experience at tackle.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

im a kool aid drinker. but our line, as it stands right now, scares the shit out of me

Re: Heyer Injured
 

Eventually Vinny & Danny needs to realize you can't have a franchise QB with a terrible o-line. You also can't make strides with your receivers and QB if JC doesn't have a line. [B]In the next a couple of years, we need to dedicate the draft to getting an all-star o-line simple as that.[/B]

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;572598]Boy, I am really tired of the constant reference to the last 8 games as if the first 8 didn't mean anything and also as if this is the same group that hobbled to the finish line. Jansen is gone . Kendall, who took nearly every Wednesday off is gone, samuels is lean mean and determined, Dockery is his able bodied sidekick ready to fend off the dastardly advances of the evil doers in dallas philly ny or any other place that evil opponents may raise their heads. In the first 8 games we ran over teams, without samuels healthy and facing the top 1,2, 3, 5,8,etc defenses in a row we got run over. Its a NEW season, JZ understands better the wear and tear aspect and is leading this team onward. Please let's all agree that last season is over and the new one just begun. Look to the positives throughout camp, trust the koolaid is not spiked.

Thank you for your time, u may now return to ur regularly scheduled worry and disillusionment with our team.[/quote]


So you are honestly happy with our offensive line? You know what I am going to do, smack your cup of kool-aid off the table.

Do you realize that our starting center, right guard and right tackle were off the practice field today? Are you serious? Samuels will be fine. Dockery is barely an upgrade over Kendall, no matter what anyone says.

You may be just fine with 8-8, which is definitely attainable with this defense, I am not.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=dmek25;572604]im a kool aid drinker. but our line, as it stands right now, scares the shit out of me[/quote]

This is a very reasonable post. The same line that crumbled and failed us last year is a year older, had several additional surgeries and is already falling apart.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

Kool Aid is bad for you, it rots your teeth and makes you fat.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;572619]So you are honestly happy with our offensive line? You know what I am going to do, smack your cup of kool-aid off the table.

Do you realize that our starting center, right guard and right tackle were off the practice field today? Are you serious? Samuels will be fine. Dockery is barely an upgrade over Kendall, no matter what anyone says.

You may be just fine with 8-8, which is definitely attainable with this defense, I am not.[/quote]

I don't know that happy is the right word. Just not panicked yet. Like I said, this is not the same line that finished the year. Dockery is younger, at least equal to kendall, samuels is healthy, heyer has a competent backup in bridges, jansen is gone. I am hopeful that rinehart will be more prepared,.

To me the center is the only spot we are just thin at.

if u look across the nfl at the best lines, I am confident most teams, are allowing there vet lines some grace time. I know dallas is, philly had both tackles held out the last two practices, I don't know about the giants. If we get to the baltimore game and our oline starters don't take the field as a unit for several series, then I will worry.

One final point, there just isn't much talent sitting out there that would upgrade your two concerns, health and age. Levi jones would, but as I said earlier he is waiting, otherwise who do we plug in that would be better than the youth we already have, and are trying to train (rinehart, williams the center, bridges).

I don't expect this line to be all-pro hogs style. But I expect that our talent positions, CP, Campbell, will be given enough time and holes to get a better job done.

By the way, the line about the koolaid was classic

Let's keep drinking at least until we see the group in action, I do have an extra cup if you want one :)

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;572579]I think that getting a free agent tackle would be a smart move, especially one of L. Jones' stature. I also think that sighning Kendall for depth would be a good idea. I am all for "coaching them up" but if we want to legitimately compete in this division this year we can't leave the most important component of the offense to chance.

Campbell needs a fair shake before they run him out of town.[/quote]

Yeah signing a O-Line is all well and good but we still have a salary cap to worry about. These Vet O-Lineman will not play for peanuts. How much do we have to spend on a quaility O-Lineman?

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;572590]Our line is in big trouble at the moment. Someone might say this is jumping the gun, I would tell them to look at the last 8 games from last year...[/quote]

Maybe this year our team will have more leads so other teams defense will be off balance against our offense. When we have a lead we can run the ball and use play action more.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=dmek25;572604]im a kool aid drinker. but our line, as it stands right now, scares the shit out of me[/quote]

Well if our O-Line scares you and your not sitting back there taking hits, than how will Jason Campbell feel? Thats why he is a QB and your a fan. We got to Man Up and go kicks some azzzzz.

Re: Heyer Injured
 

[quote=Redskin Warrior;572614]Eventually Vinny & Danny needs to realize you can't have a franchise QB with a terrible o-line. You also can't make strides with your receivers and QB if JC doesn't have a line. [B]In the next a couple of years, we need to dedicate the draft to getting an all-star o-line simple as that.[/B][/quote]

2010 Draft we go get some young O-Lineman just wait. Rome wasn't built in a day.