Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Gary84Clark;1094988]Put Cousins in, at least I get to laugh at his horror faces when the defense collides.[/quote]

KC has his issues. However, the easy routine plays that Griffin missed, KC hits those in his sleep.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Hog1;1094926]How those rape allegations going?[/quote]

There's a big difference between "allegations" and the truth. The evidence suggests no crime was committed and the accuser flat out lied about several things.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Bangee7;1094967]Cooley's piece was really good. But when I read that part, I wasn't sure he had a good bead on it.

Griff definitely is unsure of himself, holding the ball way too long.

I'm thinking if he feared the contact though, he'd be letting the ball fly much earlier, not holding it longer....he'd also bail the pocket much faster, not stand there like a statue.

IDK for sure...just hope the light goes on for the kid before too long.

Hail![/quote]

Freezing is a much more common reaction to fear than trying to place oneself out of danger.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Mattyk;1094965]I wouldn't be surprised at all if he's still a little shell shocked.[/quote]

It's obvious he is.

There is no other doubt that the guy who played in 2012 is in there somewhere because he was making these reads in 2013 as well.

Maybe it's as simple as... It's only been 12Q in this offense.

Jay even said he looks good in practice.. I'm not sure what is holding him back during the games.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Hog1;1094983]I get you. No need to say more. Traits like character, judgement, quality in an individual are important to some people and not to others. I know where you stand on that.......[/quote]

Because I clearly said that, so if someone is found innocent or charges arent filed they still are guilty and condemned in the public eye, good to know. I know where you stand on that.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Bucket;1095015]It's obvious he is.

There is no other doubt that the guy who played in 2012 is in there somewhere because he was making these reads in 2013 as well.

Maybe it's as simple as... It's only been 12Q in this offense.

[B]Jay even said he looks good in practice.. I'm not sure what is holding him back during the games.[/B][/quote]

If RGIII really looked good in practice, Gruden would not have wanted to start McCoy instead.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Lotus;1095052]If RGIII really looked good in practice, Gruden would not have wanted to start McCoy instead.[/quote]

Where did you read that? A deadspin article?

Jay never said that.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Bucket;1095054]Where did you read that? A deadspin article?

Jay never said that.[/quote]

I read that in several threads on the Warpath through knowledge provided by our own generous SS.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Lotus;1095056]I read that in several threads on the Warpath through knowledge provided by our own generous SS.[/quote]

Wait, what did I say? When?

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[QUOTE=Lotus;1095052]If RGIII really looked good in practice, Gruden would not have wanted to start McCoy instead.[/QUOTE]


How can you say this, and that Gruden has done nothing? It seems u r in the camp that he did not have a choice to start his qb. That means something when it comes to wins and losses.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

Wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole....character issues....


[quote=skinsfan69;1094923]Jamies Winston ain't looking so bad right now, is he?[/quote]

The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

Edit

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;1095060]Wait, what did I say? When?[/QUOTE]


Regardless of what you said or didnt say, what is your thought process now? Did Jay want to start Mccoy against Minny and or Tampa?

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1095066]Regardless of what you said or didnt say, what is your thought process now? Did Jay want to start Mccoy against Minny and or Tampa?[/quote]

I believe his plan all along was to start Griffin no earlier than Tampa. Gruden's in a tough spot between feeling pressure (real or imagined/implied) to win now and having the task of molding a potential franchise QB who he believes is much more raw than he thought when he took the job

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

No QB will do anything until the O-line is fixed. Don't know if RG3 will ever be good but feel that Shananhan ruined him -should not have played after the original knee injury against the Ravens to say nothing of not benching him when he got hurt against Seattle in the playoffs. RG3 will never be as good as he could have been. He should not have played at all last year - that is obvious.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;1095067]I believe his plan all along was to start Griffin no earlier than Tampa. Gruden's in a tough spot between feeling pressure (real or imagined/implied) to win now and having the task of molding a potential franchise QB who he believes is much more raw than he thought when he took the job[/QUOTE]


Thats what I thought you would say. Also happens to be exactly what I believe is happening. Its a shame.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1095060]Wait, what did I say? When?[/quote]

Sorry, I must remember someone else (not deadspin, which I never read) saying that Gruden did not want to start RGIII at the beginning of the season or against Minny. My memory declines with age.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Lotus;1095089]Sorry, I must remember someone else (not deadspin, which I never read) saying that Gruden did not want to start RGIII at the beginning of the season or against Minny. My memory declines with age.[/quote]

Oh that. I did say that. I don't remember saying anything about him not looking good in recent practices though

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=VTSkins1961;1095070]No QB will do anything until the O-line is fixed. Don't know if RG3 will ever be good but feel that Shananhan ruined him -should not have played after the original knee injury against the Ravens to say nothing of not benching him when he got hurt against Seattle in the playoffs. RG3 will never be as good as he could have been. He should not have played at all last year - that is obvious.[/quote]

Yeah, no one who has reviewed his play on film and actually has a clue wtf they're talking about agrees with you. But keep clinging to the O-line excuse as if it's the soft little woobie that helps you fall alseep at night.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=44Deezel;1095099]Yeah, no one who has reviewed his play on film and actually has a clue wtf they're talking about agrees with you. But keep clinging to the O-line excuse as if it's the soft little woobie that helps you fall alseep at night.[/quote]

Against the Bucs, sure. Not so against Minny or a fair amount of other games. But hey, keep up the whole mantra that football is not a team sport and nothing else matters except one position.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[QUOTE=44Deezel;1095099]Yeah, no one who has reviewed his play on film and actually has a clue wtf they're talking about agrees with you. But keep clinging to the O-line excuse as if it's the soft little woobie that helps you fall alseep at night.[/QUOTE]


I miss my woobie and im not afraid to admit it.

The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[QUOTE=Skinzman;1095102]Against the Bucs, sure. Not so against Minny or a fair amount of other games. But hey, keep up the whole mantra that football is not a team sport and nothing else matters except one position.[/QUOTE]


Of course it is a team sport, but I dont think the bad habits/effed up things that Cooley and others have pointed out that Griff did against the Bucs were by any stretch of the imagination an isolated incident. If they were we wouldnt be having this conversation. Not over one game.
Also, nobody is denying our oline sucks or our safeties suck, but none of them were drafted number two overall in exchange for so much. If they were they would be called out by name like Griff.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Skinzman;1095102]Against the Bucs, sure. Not so against Minny or a fair amount of other games. But hey, keep up the whole mantra that football is not a team sport and nothing else matters except one position.[/quote]

In your head, how do you explain that KC takes so much fewer sacks per attempt since the start of 2013?

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Hijinx;1095109]In your head, how do you explain that KC takes so much fewer sacks per attempt since the start of 2013?[/quote]

He throws it in the general direction of a player not wearing the same jersey as him when pressured?

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Hijinx;1095109]In your head, how do you explain that KC takes so much fewer sacks per attempt since the start of 2013?[/quote]

Any QB that does a three step drop and throws it immediately at the defense will have less sacks. That doesnt mean it is proper QB play.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=punch it in;1095105]Of course it is a team sport, but I dont think the bad habits/effed up things that Cooley and others have pointed out that Griff did against the Bucs were by any stretch of the imagination an isolated incident. If they were we wouldnt be having this conversation. Not over one game.
Also, nobody is denying our oline sucks or our safeties suck, but none of them were drafted number two overall in exchange for so much. If they were they would be called out by name like Griff.[/quote]

And I have already gave my input on how I think a bad OL impacts a developing QB. If its not RG3, so be it, but the next guy we bring in is either a cast off or a rookie since the elites, and even average to better than average arent available. If we go with a rookie, we still wont develop that next young guy when he deals with constant pressure plus the fact that he has to outscore our own defense.

Get rid of RG3, fine... Just make sure the next guy brought in is given a chance to develop. Because we dont have that now, and moving on before we get it is pointless.

I still dont think most of you are getting what I am saying. Im not going to blame RG3 and only RG3 as most others are doing since there is a ton of crap to go around. All of you seem to think the fact that I think we have massive deficiencies at a lot of positions is somehow a defense of RG3. But get rid of RG3, and you still have a ton of crap minus 1 guy. And after we ruin the next young QB, we are back to a full load of crap. Changing the QB will not matter long term without making other changes.

There is a reason prior to the season when this board had a "Guess the record" thread that I put in 5-8 wins on the season. Because thats all I thought we would get. Changing RG3 for Colt does not change that impression by me. We are a bad team.

As to the nobody denying that our OL sucks. Uh... Just ask SS, he seems to think its pretty good. Just ask the people that keep telling me that its not the OL contributing to any problems. There are plenty of people on this board that thinks our OL is quite good.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

I never said the OL is pretty good. What I said was the problems go beyond the OL, a unit which we have invested in (wisely? maybe not, but we have)

I said RG3 has to share the blame. And he has to share a lot of the blame, just like he would get a lot of the credit. I said it's not fair, but it's how it is. You're the #2 overall pick. Multiple picks were traded for you. The offense is a quick release offense that benefits a mobile QB so like it or not Rob you have to step up.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1095116]I never said the OL is pretty good. What I said was the problems go beyond the OL, a unit which we have invested in (wisely? maybe not, but we have)

I said RG3 has to share the blame. And he has to share a lot of the blame, just like he would get a lot of the credit. I said it's not fair, but it's how it is. You're the #2 overall pick. Multiple picks were traded for you. The offense is a quick release offense that benefits a mobile QB so like it or not Rob you have to step up.[/quote]

I dont recall saying RG3 doesnt deserve part of the blame. He flat out cost us the bucs game, thats not on anyone else. However, the Minny game is not all on RG3, not even close. He gets the blame rightly for that 4th down throw on the last drive, but no one will even mention the fact that we had a first down already if another stupid penalty hadnt been committed to negate a first down the play prior. No one wants to talk about our false starts on the very first play of a drive that happened several times against the bucs. Those are killers, especially with a young QB. But anytime I say other positions need to improve, here you come with the its the OL's fault meant as sarcasm and other people telling me im nuts that the ONLY problem on this team is RG3.

The fact is if we want to develop a young QB, we need massive improvements elsewhere. Now, If we can get Green Bay to trade us Aaron Rodgers... What are the odds of that happening?

Also, I frankly dont care if we have invested in it. I care if its good. Heres to hoping that Moses and Long develop correctly.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=jdlea;1095111]He throws it in the general direction of a player not wearing the same jersey as him when pressured?[/quote]

Didn't he throw 2 picks on Sunday? And it is easy to throw less picks when you fail to throw the ball. Or if you only hit the check down. But you can't win games like that either.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Hijinx;1095120]Didn't he throw 2 picks on Sunday? And it is easy to throw less picks when you fail to throw the ball. Or if you only hit the check down. But you can't win games like that either.[/quote]

Yes, he did. No one ever disputed that. It also just got him to surpass Kirk in career picks in spite of the fact that Kirk has played in less than half as many games as Robert. Also, their yards per attempt are about the same for their careers, with Kirk's is higher this season by almost a yard, still, 7.6 is pretty high, doesn't lend much credence to your "check down" argument.

Robert did not play well on Sunday. That said, some people think there are also other problems and that he's the most talented guy who plays QB for the Washington Redskins. If he doesn't develop, the Skins need a new quarterback, because we don't have one.

My biggest issue with all of this? Why is it that Gruden gets a free pass? Isn't he supposed to be the guy who was responsible for Dalton's success? Where is the guru now? Why have both young quarterbacks failed to produce under him so far? At this point, I don't particularly care who you preferred to start, this team isn't any good and the quarterbacks aren't playing well; I thought that was your area of expertise. If you're not developing someone, you're wasting our time and I don't have any clue why you were hired in the first place.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

Nobody gets a free pass. But should we fire Gruden if we end up 3-13 again? I wouldn't. Should we bring back RGIII next season? I would. My (admittedly slim) hope is that this is part of the U-shaped learning curve that often happens when you have to unlearn old habits and develop new ones. But what are the real options here? I take it Colt is not franchise QB--he's a place-holder at best. So we need to get someone else. Who? Draft? FA? In the meantime, why not play out RGIII for the final six and the first half of next year, just to see? I don't think we've got a better option. Meanwhile, draft and FA more good players and develop some of the young guys. It's an unhappy plan, but if RGIII is a bust, we're looking at a long rebuild. So you might as well keep RGIII as you rebuild just to be sure.

(I think Haz has long sinced proved he's not worth keeping around. How shitty does the D have to be before he's gone???)

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=jdlea;1095121]
My biggest issue with all of this? Why is it that Gruden gets a free pass? Isn't he supposed to be the guy who was responsible for Dalton's success? [/quote]

Grunden gets a pass because, last year the narrative out of Redskin FO, the pro-RG3 people on this site and the RG3 camp was that last season was all the fault of the head coach. [I]Oh, if only the Shanahans weren't mean to Rg3. If only the coaching was better, RG3 was this elite QB who was being thwarted by the head coach.[/I]

That and [B]EVERYONE[/B] who understands QB mechanics for a living says RG3 is a mess. People who do this stuff for a living say this, not one dissenting voice.

Maybe Dalton worked harder at it, maybe Dalton is smarter, maybe Dalton doesn't have a swollen head and think he already knows everything. I can't say. What I can say is that, when a play calls for a 3 step drop and you drop 5 steps or one step and start hoping around, that is not a coaching problem that is a QB problem. When a WR is open and the QB is staring down the wrong receiver, then goes for the check down, thats a QB problem. Coaching doesn't fix that.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

What about Sam Bradford? If he could ever stay healthy, he could run this offense and run it pretty well. If I were the Redskins, I'd make a call to the Rams and have a conversation. I'm sure they'd listen.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Hijinx;1095127]Grunden gets a pass because, last year the narrative out of Redskin FO, the pro-RG3 people on this site and the RG3 camp was that last season was all the fault of the head coach. [I]Oh, if only the Shanahans weren't mean to Rg3. If only the coaching was better, RG3 was this elite QB who was being thwarted by the head coach.[/I]

That and [B]EVERYONE[/B] who understands QB mechanics for a living says RG3 is a mess. People who do this stuff for a living say this, not one dissenting voice.

Maybe Dalton worked harder at it, maybe Dalton is smarter, maybe Dalton doesn't have a swollen head and think he already knows everything. I can't say. What I can say is that, when a play calls for a 3 step drop and you drop 5 steps or one step and start hoping around, that is not a coaching problem that is a QB problem. When a WR is open and the QB is staring down the wrong receiver, then goes for the check down, thats a QB problem. Coaching doesn't fix that.[/quote]

And once again you ignored what I said in order to turn your post into an opportunity to bash Griffin. I'm not saying that Robert doesn't have work to do. However, if a play isn't understood by the QB and he takes the wrong drop, that seems, at least a little bit like a coaching problem.

I have a question: Do you believe the TEAM looked ready to play Sunday? If not, why is that? I blame the coach when, coming off a bye, or any time really, but especially coming off a bye, a team look as bad as the Skins did on Sunday. Everyone looked awful, Griffin included. No one is arguing any different.

EDIT: Another note, if Griffin's not getting better, how is that not a coach's failing? How is it not his fault in any way? How is not Gruden or McVay's fault that Cousins also looked horrible?

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=Hijinx;1095127]Grunden gets a pass because, last year the narrative out of Redskin FO, the pro-RG3 people on this site and the RG3 camp was that last season was all the fault of the head coach. [I]Oh, if only the Shanahans weren't mean to Rg3. If only the coaching was better, RG3 was this elite QB who was being thwarted by the head coach.[/I]

That and [B]EVERYONE[/B] who understands QB mechanics for a living says RG3 is a mess. People who do this stuff for a living say this, not one dissenting voice.

Maybe Dalton worked harder at it, maybe Dalton is smarter, maybe Dalton doesn't have a swollen head and think he already knows everything. I can't say. What I can say is that, when a play calls for a 3 step drop and you drop 5 steps or one step and start hoping around, that is not a coaching problem that is a QB problem. When a WR is open and the QB is staring down the wrong receiver, then goes for the check down, thats a QB problem. Coaching doesn't fix that.[/quote]

C'mon Hijinx, it's still Mike Shanahan's fault!

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=jdlea;1095131]And once again you ignored what I said in order to turn your post into an opportunity to bash Griffin. I'm not saying that Robert doesn't have work to do. However, if a play isn't understood by the QB and he takes the wrong drop, that seems, at least a little bit like a coaching problem.

I have a question: Do you believe the TEAM looked ready to play Sunday? If not, why is that? I blame the coach when, coming off a bye, or any time really, but especially coming off a bye, a team look as bad as the Skins did on Sunday. Everyone looked awful, Griffin included. No one is arguing any different.

EDIT: Another note, if Griffin's not getting better, how is that not a coach's failing? How is it not his fault in any way? How is not Gruden or McVay's fault that Cousins also looked horrible?[/quote]

I thought they were ready to play. Hard to win a game when two turnovers directly account for 10 points. We ran the ball well, wr's were open, defense gave up some big plays but they basically held TB to 17. A big reason for this loss was poor QB play.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1095133]I thought they were ready to play. Hard to win a game when two turnovers directly account for 10 points. We ran the ball well, wr's were open, defense gave up some big plays but they basically held TB to 17. A big reason for this loss was poor QB play.[/quote]

Fair enough, we'll have to agree to disagree in that regard, but that's fine.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

From what I've seen the o-line is a bottom third o-line. They are not the worst but far from the best. I was disappointed in some Jay's coaching decisions this season but think it is absurd to let him go after one season. That being said the Skins should not pick up Robert's extension for the 5th year. He just hasn't earned it. The weapons that we have on this team most QBs would love to have. For what was shelled out for Robert it is not over reacting to have expectations that he would be making us competitive within the NFCE.

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1095010]There's a big difference between "allegations" and the truth. The evidence suggests no crime was committed and the accuser flat out lied about several things.[/quote]
It is a lengthy laundry list of many.......character issues?
Alleged crab leg...
Alleged...to funny

[url=http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/jameis-winston-florida-state-tallahassee-police-hindered-investigation-documents-101014]Police, Florida State hampered Jameis Winston investigation, documents show | FOX Sports[/url].

"After learning in December 2013 that charges wouldn’t be filed, FOX Sports examined thousands of pages of documents. Among those findings, it was revealed that when Tallahassee police caught wind that a reporter was looking into the alleged rape, they turned reports in the case over to Florida State administrators. By November of 2013, nearly a year after a woman alleged that Winston raped her and nine months after Tallahassee police shelved the case, the Florida State administrators had those documents."

Where there's smoke..........

Re: The RG3 Sucks - Knee Jerk Reaction Thread
 

Sam Bradford anyone? Anyone?