Ocho Cinco In B&G

[sandtrapjack]

It takes two to make a trade.
Washington may want to trade for CJ, but the Bengals want nothing to do with it. The Benglas have strongly denied anything regarding trading CJ. And they have stated that Johnson is under contract with them until 2011, and will remain under contract. Marvin Lewis has stated publicly that Johnson will NOT be traded, that he will play in Cincy next season.

If the Bengals trade CJ, the Bengals will take an IMMEDIATE 8 mill dollar hit against their cap.

Bengals will NOT trade Ocho-Cinco. He will be in a Bengals uniform next season.

[Stuck in TX]

Originally Posted by sandtrapjack

It takes two to make a trade.
Washington may want to trade for CJ, but the Bengals want nothing to do with it. The Benglas have strongly denied anything regarding trading CJ. And they have stated that Johnson is under contract with them until 2011, and will remain under contract. Marvin Lewis has stated publicly that Johnson will NOT be traded, that he will play in Cincy next season.

If the Bengals trade CJ, the Bengals will take an IMMEDIATE 8 mill dollar hit against their cap.

Bengals will NOT trade Ocho-Cinco. He will be in a Bengals uniform next season.

Hurts (given the Avatar) but I've gotta agree. the Washington Post reports that the Redskins are interested but they didnt say anything about Cincy being interested.

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by sandtrapjack

It takes two to make a trade.
Washington may want to trade for CJ, but the Bengals want nothing to do with it. The Benglas have strongly denied anything regarding trading CJ. And they have stated that Johnson is under contract with them until 2011, and will remain under contract. Marvin Lewis has stated publicly that Johnson will NOT be traded, that he will play in Cincy next season.

If the Bengals trade CJ, the Bengals will take an IMMEDIATE 8 mill dollar hit against their cap.

Bengals will NOT trade Ocho-Cinco. He will be in a Bengals uniform next season.

All I want to know is: How you can begin talking contract with a player already under contract with another team? League rules do not permit that.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

All I want to know is: How you can begin talking contract with a player already under contract with another team? League rules do not permit that.

We did the same thing with Briggs. We had a deal in place ready to be signed before a trade fell through. I'm not sure of the specifics regarding any league rules, but discussing contract parameters does not seem to be against the rules if teams are discussing a trade.

[Longtimefan]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

We did the same thing with Briggs. We had a deal in place ready to be signed before a trade fell through. I'm not sure of the specifics regarding any league rules, but discussing contract parameters does not seem to be against the rules if teams are discussing a trade.

I have been trying to find more information that will clarify the NFL rules regarding tampering.

I do beleive in the case with Briggs last year, both sides were open to trade possibilities, in the case of CJ Bengals management is maintaining they have no intention of trading him. I could be wrong, but I beleive we're dealing with a different set of circumstances.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

I have been trying to find more information that will clarify the NFL rules regarding tampering.

I do beleive in the case with Briggs last year, both sides were open to trade possibilities, in the case of CJ Bengals management is maintaining they have no intention of trading him. I could be wrong, but I believe we're dealing with a different set of circumstances.

I believe the essential difference was that last year Briggs was a free agent, that the Bears applied the "franchise tag" to.

So once free agency begins all parties can have discussions and try to work out essentially a sign and trade. After all, that's tone of the main purposes of applying the "franchise tag", to make sure if you're going to lose a free agent you get something in return.

There's probably more to it...but I'm tired

[Longtimefan]

This from Cincinnati.com THE ENQUIRER

REPORT: REDSKINS WANT CHAD

The latest Chad Johnson trade rumor involves another team, the Washington Redskins.

Redskins' owner Daniel Snyder is interested in trading with the Bengals for the disgruntled Johnson, according to a report published Tuesday in the Washington Post.

The newspaper reported that Drew Rosenhaus, Johnson's agent, is working quietly with the Bengals and Redskins to broker a trade. Johnson, a member of five consecutive AFC Pro Bowl teams, was the fourth highest paid wide-out in the NFL in 2007, according to NFL Players Association figures.

Reached Tuesday by the Enquirer, Rosenhaus didn't deny the report.

"I understand the reports," Rosenhaus said. "But I have no comment, other than to say again that whatever conversations I am having with the Bengals regarding Chad will remain private."

An obstacle to any trade of Johnson would be the salary cap hit the Bengals would suffer.

The Bengals would lose $8.03 million on the salary cap-money the club would not have to spend on other players-if it traded or released Johnson before June 1, said Marc Levin, Director of the Salary Cap and Agent Administration Department for the NFL Players Association.

"And there is nothing the Bengals can do about it," Levin said in an e-mail sent by the union to the Enquirer.

A trade or contract termination done June or after gives NFL teams another year to absorb the salary cap implication, in this case, 2008 and 2009. The salary cap for 2008 is $116 million, up from $109 million in 2007.

The Bengals had no comment Tuesday on the Johnson situation, team public relations Jack Brennan said.

NFL tampering rules could come into play. The Bengals could file a complaint with the league if the Washington Post report did originate with sources inside the Redskins organization.

"Any public or private statement of interest in another club's employee is a violation," the rule states.

Johnson remains under contract with the Bengals through 2011, the result of an extension he signed with the club in April 2006.

Citing unnamed "league sources," the Post reported that Snyder, coaching candidates and Redskin Executive Vice President Vinny Cerrato discussed Johnson specifically. And Johnson, two more league sources told the Post, wants a hefty new contract from the Redskins.

Clubs can give a player's agent permission to talk to other teams about a possible trade.

"Yes it is permissible, but if a club does give permission to an agent it is recommended that the permission given to the agent be spelled out in a written document to avoid a dispute about it in the future, "Greg Aiello, NFL Senior Vice President of Public Relations, wrote to The Enquirer in an e-mail Tuesday.

If the Bengals trade Johnson, they would be forced to accelerate what remains of the almost $21 million in up-front money paid Johnson in the contract extensions from November 2003 and April 2006.

"Acceleration of signing bonus after a player is released or traded has always been part of this system," Aiello wrote. "The point is that all money paid to a player will be accounted for under the cap."

The Bengals signed Johnson to what amounts to a six-year contract in 2006. He has been paid almost $16 million by the Bengals in the past two seasons.

Since early January, Johnson has used national media, primarily radio shows, including those with tables on "Radio Row" at the Super Bowl earlier this month, to voice his displeasure with the Bengals. He said if he is the Bengals problem, he should be dealt. Johnson has not talked to local media since mid-October.

The Bengals have the ninth overall pick in the 2008 draft and the Redskins the 21st in the first round.

Rosenhaus negotiated the 2006 extension for Johnson.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by sandtrapjack

It takes two to make a trade.
Washington may want to trade for CJ, but the Bengals want nothing to do with it. The Benglas have strongly denied anything regarding trading CJ. And they have stated that Johnson is under contract with them until 2011, and will remain under contract. Marvin Lewis has stated publicly that Johnson will NOT be traded, that he will play in Cincy next season.

If the Bengals trade CJ, the Bengals will take an IMMEDIATE 8 mill dollar hit against their cap.

Bengals will NOT trade Ocho-Cinco. He will be in a Bengals uniform next season.

hope you're right sand, but

1) don't put too much stock into what the bengals brass is saying, that's part of postering to gian leverage if they do deal him,
2) If I'm correct, can't a team agree to take on the cap hit in a trade? I know it's all subject to the individual deal, but I recall us & the Jets negotiating this when we traded coles for Moss. Ditto last year when we sent Arch to the Bears, they took some of the cap hit/bonus.

If you're right that it's an 8mil cap hit (what's yo source?) that might even be too much for the danny & his crack team of capologists to manoever around.

What about this scenario, CJ acts a fool during the season & the Bengals choose to deal him rather than keyshawn him. Wonder what the price would be then?

[Tha Posse]

Look like Dallas is already sweating at just the mention of us getting him, lol I love it. Anyway it sounds like CJ is pretty intent on wanting a trade, so if he wants out that badly I'm sure he can cook up some way of getting out of cincy. Wasn't it Briggs who vowed not to play in Chicago if he wasn't traded last year, and yes he did end up staying and playing. But I think CJ is the type that doesn't bluff. I hope we do get him, then we'll finally have a solid #2 in Moss. But I wonder if this pisses Moss off????

[sandtrapjack]

Originally Posted by freddyg12

hope you're right sand, but

1) don't put too much stock into what the bengals brass is saying, that's part of postering to gian leverage if they do deal him,
2) If I'm correct, can't a team agree to take on the cap hit in a trade? I know it's all subject to the individual deal, but I recall us & the Jets negotiating this when we traded coles for Moss. Ditto last year when we sent Arch to the Bears, they took some of the cap hit/bonus.

If you're right that it's an 8mil cap hit (what's yo source?) that might even be too much for the danny & his crack team of capologists to manoever around.

What about this scenario, CJ acts a fool during the season & the Bengals choose to deal him rather than keyshawn him. Wonder what the price would be then?

Source is the dead money associated with Johnsons current contract in Cincy. The remainder of his pro-rated signing bonus through 2011 is about 8 mill. And as soon as he is traded all 8 mil counts against the Bengals cap.

Originally Posted by The Posse

Look like Dallas is already sweating at just the mention of us getting him, lol I love it.

No not sweating it at all. What is there to sweat? Johnson would probably have better numbers in Cincinnati with a Pro Bowl QB in Palmer than he would with a QB who is changing offensive systems for, what, the 3rd time?
And who is still considered to be "developing"? Johnson's production will take a hit if traded to Washington.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by sandtrapjack

Source is the dead money associated with Johnsons current contract in Cincy. The remainder of his pro-rated signing bonus through 2011 is about 8 mill. And as soon as he is traded all 8 mil counts against the Bengals cap.

I would venture to say though that his Cap Number is between 6-8 million anyway, so obviously this wouldn't cripple the Bengals cap any more than Brandon Lloyd would ours.

[sandtrapjack]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

I would venture to say though that his Cap Number is between 6-8 million anyway, so obviously this wouldn't cripple the Bengals cap any more than Brandon Lloyd would ours.

The difference being that fans don't buy tickets to see Brandon Lloyd or buy his jersey. So Washington does not really make anything from his presence.

Johnson, on the other hand, sells jerseys and tickets which means millions of additional revenue for just being on the roster and on the field.

By dumping Lloyd, the Skins do not loose any fan revenue, because he does not exactly sell tons of fan merchandise.

By letting Johnson go not only does the Bengals take a substantial cap hit in dead money, but they would also loose some valuable fan revenue in addition to the cap hit.

Trust me there are more Chad Johnson Bengals jerseys being sold then there are Brandon Lloyd Redskins Jerseys.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by sandtrapjack

The difference being that fans don't buy tickets to see Brandon Lloyd or buy his jersey. So Washington does not really make anything from his presence.

Johnson, on the other hand, sells jerseys and tickets which means millions of additional revenue for just being on the roster and on the field.

By dumping Lloyd, the Skins do not loose any fan revenue, because he does not exactly sell tons of fan merchandise.

By letting Johnson go not only does the Bengals take a substantial cap hit in dead money, but they would also loose some valuable fan revenue in addition to the cap hit.

Trust me there are more Chad Johnson Bengals jerseys being sold then there are Brandon Lloyd Redskins Jerseys.

Sandtrap, that's as insightful as your boy Emmit Smith!

Don't know that player merchandise sales really factor into such deals that much, however if you look at the overall economic impact of having a certain player, e.g. Vick in Atl. before he let the dogs out, you may have a point. Does CJ sell tickets & market the team? I think so & that adds to his value in cincy, a small market.