Obama Care

[GhettoDogAllStars]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Pretty much. Instead of some fairyland fantasy utopia you should consider taking a long hard look at the real world. Seems like everyone else in this thread at least a has firm grasp on reality.

I understand. You feel superior to me, and that satisfies your ego. Good for you. Keep on keepin' on, bro.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars

I understand. You feel superior to me, and that satisfies your ego. Good for you. Keep on keepin' on, bro.

I think I get your drift. You're basically saying that if we could let go of our desire for material things and creature comforts, we'd be able to afford healthcare a lot more easily.

But the guys are right, that's fantasy land. Everyone likes HDTVs, everyone likes IPhones, everyone likes to spend money to attend Redskins games or subscribe to DirecTV. That won't change. Only a small fraction of the population would ever think along your lines.

Believing in your line of thinking is one thing, but the only way you can truly change the world is if you "carry the room". Can your line of thinking relate to others, can you convince them? Human nature says not in this case.

It's a nice thought, but it's way out of touch with the way most people think. To think you could convince the world to adjust to this line of thinking shows you're detached from reality. And if you don't think people are capable of being convinced of this, then you're dreaming of the possibility, not thinking about a reality.

[GhettoDogAllStars]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I think I get your drift. You're basically saying that if we could let go of our desire for material things and creature comforts, we'd be able to afford healthcare a lot more easily.

But the guys are right, that's fantasy land. Everyone likes HDTVs, everyone likes IPhones, everyone likes to spend money to attend Redskins games or subscribe to DirecTV. That won't change. Only a small fraction of the population would ever think along your lines.

Believing in your line of thinking is one thing, but the only way you can truly change the world is if you "carry the room". Can your line of thinking relate to others, can you convince them? Human nature says not in this case.

It's a nice thought, but it's way out of touch with the way most people think. To think you could convince the world to adjust to this line of thinking shows you're detached from reality. And if you don't think people are capable of being convinced of this, then you're dreaming of the possibility, not thinking about a reality.

First of all, it's not *my* line of thinking in the regards that it is not my original thought. Perhaps you didn't mean it that way. Just wanted to make that point clear.

Second of all, I never claimed to be able, nor desire, to convince anyone of anything -- especially something like this. Awakening cannot be provoked, nor influenced by external forces. That is why you don't get it, and neither does buttplug.

Read my posts. You think I'm some kind of hippie, just like others you've met, and you erroneously assume that I'm preaching what they do. Hence, you draw conclusions about me based on that image, and not from my posts. That is why you mistakenly assumed my motive is to convince people. You're wrong. Seems like you are a bit out of touch my friend.

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars

First of all, it's not *my* line of thinking in the regards that it is not my original thought. Perhaps you didn't mean it that way. Just wanted to make that point clear.

Second of all, I never claimed to be able, nor desire, to convince anyone of anything -- especially something like this. Awakening cannot be provoked, nor influenced by external forces. That is why you don't get it, and neither does buttplug.

Read my posts. You think I'm some kind of hippie, just like others you've met, and you erroneously assume that I'm preaching what they do. Hence, you draw conclusions about me based on that image, and not from my posts. That is why you mistakenly assumed my motive is to convince people. You're wrong. Seems like you are a bit out of touch my friend.

Wow you're touchy, so easily offended. Nowhere did I criticize you so let's relax or I'm going to abandon the discussion. I never said you were a hippy. I didn't draw conclusions based on an image.

I simply stated what I thought you were saying:

Originally Posted by Schneed10

I think I get your drift. You're basically saying that if we could let go of our desire for material things and creature comforts, we'd be able to afford healthcare a lot more easily.

You neither confirmed nor denied that the line above was an accurate representation of your jist. Am I on track? Feel free to correct me if I'm not.

Seems unproductive to fire barbs at me when all I'm doing is trying to tie up the loose end in our communication; I'm just trying to make sure I understand you.

If I understood you appropriately, then my response said it all. If you don't believe others can be convinced to give up the material thinking, then you are consciously not working within the confines of reality. If I misunderstood your view, please feel free to clarify.

[GhettoDogAllStars]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Wow you're touchy, so easily offended. Nowhere did I criticize you so let's relax or I'm going to abandon the discussion. I never said you were a hippy. I didn't draw conclusions based on an image.

I simply stated what I thought you were saying:



You neither confirmed nor denied that the line above was an accurate representation of your jist. Am I on track? Feel free to correct me if I'm not.

Seems unproductive to fire barbs at me when all I'm doing is trying to tie up the loose end in our communication; I'm just trying to make sure I understand you.

If I understood you appropriately, then my response said it all. If you don't believe others can be convinced to give up the material thinking, then you are consciously not working within the confines of reality. If I misunderstood your view, please feel free to clarify.

Yeah, I've been a little touchy lately. Sorry for that.

However, you did criticize me, by saying that I am, "detached from reality," by assuming that I feel like I can convince people to think absent of ego. I am not trying to convince people of anything, and awakening cannot come from a convincing argument. So, your assumption led to the insult. See my response to SS33 for an explanation of why that response could be construed as insulting.

As for whether you're on track in understanding my point, yeah pretty much -- and I commend you for actually caring to try and understand me. Although, I'm not really thinking about the costs. I'm thinking in terms of principle (not reality, right?) -- we should look out for one another, and ensure that everyone has access to healthcare, among other things. Be our brothers' keepers, if you will.

If people identified less with their ego, they would not resist this so much, and they would be more concerned with finding ways to make it work -- rather than finding reasons to discredit it. I hear the same argument over and over: why should I help others? Why should I do for them, what they can't/won't do for themselves? Because it's better than neglecting them. That's all I'm saying.

"Blessed is he who considers the poor, The Lord will deliver him in time of trouble." -Psalm 41:1

BTW, I'm not a Christian, and I don't read the Bible. So, I don't want to misrepresent myself. I just know that most Americans are, and they can relate better to quotes from the Bible -- know what I mean?

[Schneed10]

Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars

Yeah, I've been a little touchy lately. Sorry for that.

However, you did criticize me, by saying that I am, "detached from reality," by assuming that I feel like I can convince people to think absent of ego. I am not trying to convince people of anything, and awakening cannot come from a convincing argument. So, your assumption led to the insult. See my response to SS33 for an explanation of why that response could be construed as insulting.

As for whether you're on track in understanding my point, yeah pretty much -- and I commend you for actually caring to try and understand me. Although, I'm not really thinking about the costs. I'm thinking in terms of principle (not reality, right?) -- we should look out for one another, and ensure that everyone has access to healthcare, among other things. Be our brothers' keepers, if you will.

If people identified less with their ego, they would not resist this so much, and they would be more concerned with finding ways to make it work -- rather than finding reasons to discredit it. I hear the same argument over and over: why should I help others? Why should I do for them, what they can't/won't do for themselves? Because it's better than neglecting them. That's all I'm saying.

"Blessed is he who considers the poor, The Lord will deliver him in time of trouble." -Psalm 41:1

BTW, I'm not a Christian, and I don't read the Bible. So, I don't want to misrepresent myself. I just know that most Americans are, and they can relate better to quotes from the Bible -- know what I mean?

OK I see. And by the way no criticism was intended, I'm just observing that this line of thinking has no practical application in our lives. And it never will. That's not a criticism, just an expression of my opinion.

Especially when it comes to our kids, we're genetically programmed to look out for ourselves to provide as much as we possibly can for them. I don't view myself as my brother's keeper, I view myself as my daughters' keeper. And consciously or unconsciously, I could never strip that away from myself.

Nice thought though, file it under the category of 'wouldn't it be nice.'

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

OK I see. And by the way no criticism was intended, I'm just observing that this line of thinking has no practical application in our lives. And it never will. That's not a criticism, just an expression of my opinion.

Especially when it comes to our kids, we're genetically programmed to look out for ourselves to provide as much as we possibly can for them. I don't view myself as my brother's keeper, I view myself as my daughters' keeper. And consciously or unconsciously, I could never strip that away from myself.

Nice thought though, file it under the category of 'wouldn't it be nice.'

My thought on self interest goes even deeper. No human does one single thing ever that doesn't provide benefit to them self. Nothing. It isn't possible for us to act in any different way. The main crux is that "benefit" is different from person to person. I, like you, would do anything to protect my kids. Why? Why do I care about some other human so much? Well I am responsible for existence(at least 50%) so I feel I am responsible to get them through life as safely and happily as possible, Why? Because I'd feel like a pure ass if I didn't. And there it is. I do it so I don't feel like an ass. That's an extremely simple explanation for a much more complicated situation but at it's base it is probably the reason that everyone who loves and cherishes their kids do so. It all comes back to the self. There is no other way.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars

First of all, it's not *my* line of thinking in the regards that it is not my original thought. Perhaps you didn't mean it that way. Just wanted to make that point clear.

Second of all, I never claimed to be able, nor desire, to convince anyone of anything -- especially something like this. Awakening cannot be provoked, nor influenced by external forces. That is why you don't get it, and neither does buttplug.

Read my posts. You think I'm some kind of hippie, just like others you've met, and you erroneously assume that I'm preaching what they do. Hence, you draw conclusions about me based on that image, and not from my posts. That is why you mistakenly assumed my motive is to convince people. You're wrong. Seems like you are a bit out of touch my friend.

Wow. Not only are you loopie you're also a flaming douche. Good combo.

[GhettoDogAllStars]

Originally Posted by FRPLG

Wow. Not only are you loopie you're also a flaming douche. Good combo.

I'm sure if you met me in real life you would think otherwise, and I'm sure I would do the same of you. Just keep in mind, you were the one who jumped in just to insult me.

[FRPLG]

Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars

I'm sure if you met me in real life you would think otherwise, and I'm sure I would do the same of you. Just keep in mind, you were the one who jumped in just to insult me.

Exactly where did ANYONE insult you? Your reaction to someone not agreeing with you is that they are insulting you? I think you should heed some of the sentiments you yourself have already written because the only one here who is "assuming" what others are thinking is you.

[Beemnseven]

For those of you with a lot of time, here's a very long (9 pages) article about the history of the healthcare system in America, and how it got so expensive and out of control. Actually, the last two pages are source references. If nothing else, add it to your Favorites and read it when you have time.

While the main premise is how government intervention, rules and regulations basically got us to where we are, doctors and hospitals don't escape criticism either. This was written back in 1993 -- the last time there was a big push for a national healthcare program.

Health care in the twentieth century: a history of government interference and protection | Business Economics | Find Articles at BNET