What has Obama done well?

[dmek25]

im with saden. TTE, whats the major problem with Obama showing another leader some respect? is it kind of like someone going to another country and expecting them to speak english? us darn arrogant Americans

[jsarno]

Originally Posted by dmek25

im with saden. TTE, whats the major problem with Obama showing another leader some respect? is it kind of like someone going to another country and expecting them to speak english? us darn arrogant Americans

Well, when we go to another country, we bring interpreters, and vice versa when they come here. Bowing to a "king" is not a sign of respect as much as it is submission. It shows Obama's willingness to be submissive to another country and their ways, and in affect say "I'm sorry for america". That's the problem. We don't believe in anarchy here. In fact, we have forced other nations to be democratic. So to bow to a "king" shows lack of respect for this country and our ways. It has nothing to do with arrogance. If the king came here, do you think he would all of sudden be democratic in hs ways while on american soil? I don't think so. So why do we need to conform to their ways? It's not disrespectful to treat him with respect in regards to our culture.

In regards to the positive things Obama has done, some are very good and I wasn't aware. That was the point of this thread.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by dmek25

im with saden. TTE, whats the major problem with Obama showing another leader some respect? is it kind of like someone going to another country and expecting them to speak english? us darn arrogant Americans

I am so shocked by this. You, Saden, in agreement???? Is this the first time in Warpath history? AMAZING!

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by dmek25

im with saden. TTE, whats the major problem with Obama showing another leader some respect? is it kind of like someone going to another country and expecting them to speak english? us darn arrogant Americans

First of all, when you say us darned arrogant Americans you need to speak for yourself.

Second, the President of the United States doesn't bow before anyone, nor does any American. Showing respect means a handshake, for an officer it means a salute. When we were trained in dealing with foreign officials, to include Monarchs, it was very clear, you do not bow before anyone. If a schmuck PFC can understand that, I see no reason why his commander in chief cannot?

Going to another country and expecting them to speak English? Again, speak for yourself.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly

First of all, when you say us darned arrogant Americans you need to speak for yourself.

Second, the President of the United States doesn't bow before anyone, nor does any American. Showing respect means a handshake, for an officer it means a salute. When we were trained in dealing with foreign officials, to include Monarchs, it was very clear, you do not bow before anyone. If a schmuck PFC can understand that, I see no reason why his commander in chief cannot?

Going to another country and expecting them to speak English? Again, speak for yourself.

Who says exactly?

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Who says exactly?

A fella named Pride Ignorance.

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

Who says exactly?

I don't know of the Civic Code. The race is coming on and I don't feel like looking it up. For military personel it is the (American) Armed Forces Code of Conduct. A military officer or enlisted man who bowed before a King would be brought before NJP at the least.

The President doesn't bow for the same reason that the flag is not lowered, dignity. He isn't just some schmuck off the street. He is the representative of this Republic. When he bows he does so on our behalf.

(Taken from U.S. Code, Title 10, Chapter 36, Sec. 176. Respect for flag)
No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.

Is the Flag more important than the President?

A bow, courtsey, or kow-tow isn't a sign of respect. It is a sign of subservience. Should you choose to do so means you are subservient.

Choose the sign of serfdom if you will, an American should only bow before God. If this doesn't make sense to you, I am disheartened at your understanding of patriotism.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly

I don't know of the Civic Code. The race is coming on and I don't feel like looking it up. For military personel it is the (American) Armed Forces Code of Conduct. A military officer or enlisted man who bowed before a King would be brought before NJP at the least.

The President doesn't bow for the same reason that the flag is not lowered, dignity. He isn't just some schmuck off the street. He is the representative of this Republic. When he bows he does so on our behalf.

(Taken from U.S. Code, Title 10, Chapter 36, Sec. 176. Respect for flag)
No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.

Is the Flag more important than the President?

A bow, courtsey, or kow-tow isn't a sign of respect. It is a sign of subservience. Should you choose to do so means you are subservient.

Choose the sign of serfdom if you will, an American should only bow before God. If this doesn't make sense to you, I am disheartened at your understanding of patriotism.

Well, when you have time please let us know where it says what you claim in the Military Code of Conduct. And just to be clear it says nothing of that sort whatsoever.

And yes, the Flag is more important than the president...this is very obvious to even someone like me who believes flag burning in protest is permissible.

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by saden1

Well, when you have time please let us know where it says what you claim in the Military Code of Conduct. And just to be clear it says nothing of that sort whatsoever.

And yes, the Flag is more important than the president...this is very obvious to even someone like me who believes flag burning in protest is permissible.

No, not you Saden.

[GhettoDogAllStars]

Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly

(Taken from U.S. Code, Title 10, Chapter 36, Sec. 176. Respect for flag)
No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.

Ha! What about when a flag is lowered to half-mast for the passing of a President? Just one of many examples of contradiction within our policies. Good job proving your point.

[Trample the Elderly]

Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars

Ha! What about when a flag is lowered to half-mast for the passing of a President? Just one of many examples of contradiction within our policies. Good job proving your point.

Lowering the flag in mourning isn't the same as dipping it.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly

I don't know of the Civic Code. The race is coming on and I don't feel like looking it up. For military personel it is the (American) Armed Forces Code of Conduct. A military officer or enlisted man who bowed before a King would be brought before NJP at the least.

The President doesn't bow for the same reason that the flag is not lowered, dignity. He isn't just some schmuck off the street. He is the representative of this Republic. When he bows he does so on our behalf.

(Taken from U.S. Code, Title 10, Chapter 36, Sec. 176. Respect for flag)
No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.

Is the Flag more important than the President?

A bow, courtsey, or kow-tow isn't a sign of respect. It is a sign of subservience. Should you choose to do so means you are subservient.

Choose the sign of serfdom if you will, an American should only bow before God. If this doesn't make sense to you, I am disheartened at your understanding of patriotism.

But isn't subvervience a matter of what's perceived to be in one's heart? And I can you tell you from experience, during my enlistment during the Gulf War, we were briefed prior to leaving the ship in foreign ports. Often times we displayed a great deal of deference towards local custom and authorities.

I haven't read the UCMJ or the Code of Ethics in many years, but I'd be interested in seeing where bowing is punishable by law or deemed unpatriotic. Just to be clear, I'm not advocating that we should bow or do anything of the sort, but I would like to see where it's written.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly

I don't know of the Civic Code. The race is coming on and I don't feel like looking it up. For military personel it is the (American) Armed Forces Code of Conduct. A military officer or enlisted man who bowed before a King would be brought before NJP at the least.

The President doesn't bow for the same reason that the flag is not lowered, dignity. He isn't just some schmuck off the street. He is the representative of this Republic. When he bows he does so on our behalf.

(Taken from U.S. Code, Title 10, Chapter 36, Sec. 176. Respect for flag)
No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; the flag should not be dipped to any person or thing. Regimental colors, State flags, and organization or institutional flags are to be dipped as a mark of honor.

Is the Flag more important than the President?

A bow, courtsey, or kow-tow isn't a sign of respect. It is a sign of subservience. Should you choose to do so means you are subservient.

Choose the sign of serfdom if you will, an American should only bow before God. If this doesn't make sense to you, I am disheartened at your understanding of patriotism.

From what I understand it really depends on the culture. Bowing in many cultures is a sign or respect or even that of an apology. In some cultures yes it is a sign of subservience. The key is to know your audience.

On a related note, was W out of line when he held hands and touched cheeks with a Saudi prince?

[Trample the Elderly]

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;576496]From what I understand it really depends on the culture. Bowing in many cultures is a sign or respect or even that of an apology. In some cultures yes it is a sign of subservience. The key is to know your audience.

On a related note, was W out of line when he held hands and touched cheeks with a Saudi prince?[/QUOTE]

I don't think it was a breach of protocol but it made me want to vomit all the same.

[dmek25]

Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly

First of all, when you say us darned arrogant Americans you need to speak for yourself.

Second, the President of the United States doesn't bow before anyone, nor does any American. Showing respect means a handshake, for an officer it means a salute. When we were trained in dealing with foreign officials, to include Monarchs, it was very clear, you do not bow before anyone. If a schmuck PFC can understand that, I see no reason why his commander in chief cannot?

Going to another country and expecting them to speak English? Again, speak for yourself.

just from the tone of almost all your posts, you might even be above the most arrogant of Americans