New Look Defense

[Bangee7]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

According to CSN's mock draft, this would be our new NT.

CSN Mock has Redskins going all-defense in first two rounds

Two good picks...both look like they can help & get a lot of playing time this year.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by Bangee7

Two good picks...both look like they can help & get a lot of playing time this year.

I agree. Definite upgrades that would noticeably improve our defense.

[30gut]

CB.
DL. (NT especially)
Edge rusher.

[Alvin Walton]

I gotta believe this ads some chutzpa to using picking a D linesman in the first round.

Redskins' Trent Murphy banned four games for PEDs

[Bangee7]

Originally Posted by Alvin Walton

I gotta believe this ads some chutzpa to using picking a D linesman in the first round.

Redskins' Trent Murphy banned four games for PEDs

Yeah, sort of figured he'd get a few weeks for the PED's. If there is any good news in this, he can still practice and play in pre season games, so maybe he doesn't fall too far behind.

We seem to have quite a few question marks at that position now...Murphy & Gallete. Plus, Preston Smith & Houston Bates didn't exactly flash last year either.

[DYoungJelly]

Originally Posted by Bangee7

Yeah, sort of figured he'd get a few weeks for the PED's. If there is any good news in this, he can still practice and play in pre season games, so maybe he doesn't fall too far behind.

We seem to have quite a few question marks at that position now...Murphy & Gallete. Plus, Preston Smith & Houston Bates didn't exactly flash last year either.

Way off topic, but I really liked Bates at FB in short yardage. He reminded me of the big full back Seattle used during their SB runs.

[Bangee7]

I'm interested to see who becomes the starting NT.

Tandler says that Ziggy (6'3, 305) & Ioannidis (6' 3, 308) weren't effective at NT last year because they weren't big enough.

But, Joey Mbu (6' 3, 310) is only talked about as NT (not DE). Stacy McGee (6' 3, 310) has also played NT. Both are listed heavily right now in the NT discussion.

Seems a little weird to me that 2-5 pounds can really swing the balance in being "big enough" to play the position.

I read that Tomsula preferred big NT's, not the Jay Ratliff type that shoots the gaps???
If that's the case, then we're probably down to
Phil Taylor (335 lbs)
AJ Francis (325 lbs)
Ondre Pipkins (330 lbs)

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by Bangee7

I'm interested to see who becomes the starting NT.

Tandler says that Ziggy (6'3, 305) & Ioannidis (6' 3, 308) weren't effective at NT last year because they weren't big enough.

But, Joey Mbu (6' 3, 310) is only talked about as NT (not DE). Stacy McGee (6' 3, 310) has also played NT. Both are listed heavily right now in the NT discussion.

Seems a little weird to me that 2-5 pounds can really swing the balance in being "big enough" to play the position.

I read that Tomsula preferred big NT's, not the Jay Ratliff type that shoots the gaps???
If that's the case, then we're probably down to
Phil Taylor (335 lbs)
AJ Francis (325 lbs)
Ondre Pipkins (330 lbs)

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

If Tandler and Tomsula are right, then I'd say we still don't have a serviceable NT. Phil Taylor having a comeback season is probably our best bet but I don't recall hearing any encouraging comments about Phil from Redskins coaches.

[MTK]

Not sure I get the NT concern, seems like a lot of fretting over a guy who's probably going to play 15-20 snaps at best.

[DYoungJelly]

Originally Posted by MTK

Not sure I get the NT concern, seems like a lot of fretting over a guy who's probably going to play 15-20 snaps at best.

I respectfully disagree. I think there is a huge NT concern if the defense stays at 3-4.

The narrative goes that the defense is only in base 3-4 fifteen to twenty snaps a game, or 15 to 20 percent of snaps; I have seen the amount referenced both ways in print and heard it both ways on espn980.

Without a true NT, we have sub standard personnel on the field for that percentage of snaps.

What other position could we use sub-standard personnel as a band aid for 15-2- snaps a game? What if we used a really fast safety or LB for 15-20 snaps a game as a nickle corner?

The argument wouldn't be that we are using him for a limited number of snaps so we should not fret about it. The safety or LB would be exploited.

The two scenarios aren't analogous but similar. The main difference would be the ability of the couch potato to see the personnel weakness. With the safety or LB in coverage, we would all see the glaring weakness. With an end trying to play nose, it would take a knowledgeable fan to see the guard, who should be tied up with a mountain of a NT, killing the ILB on a run.

The point is, why play a scheme we don't have the personnel for, for any number of snaps?

Would it be good coaching to go heavy personnel last season with DJax and Crowder playing two of the TE positions as long as it was just for a few snaps?

How many snaps per game is it ok to have sub-standard personnel on the field?

[Chico23231]

Yeah, I'd personally prefer better talent at the nose...certainly wouldn't hurt. But I have a lot of faith in tomsula to find and build a guy who can help us right now.

[Bangee7]

Originally Posted by DYoungJelly

I respectfully disagree. I think there is a huge NT concern if the defense stays at 3-4.

The narrative goes that the defense is only in base 3-4 fifteen to twenty snaps a game, or 15 to 20 percent of snaps; I have seen the amount referenced both ways in print and heard it both ways on espn980.

Without a true NT, we have sub standard personnel on the field for that percentage of snaps.

What other position could we use sub-standard personnel as a band aid for 15-2- snaps a game? What if we used a really fast safety or LB for 15-20 snaps a game as a nickle corner?

The argument wouldn't be that we are using him for a limited number of snaps so we should not fret about it. The safety or LB would be exploited.

The two scenarios aren't analogous but similar. The main difference would be the ability of the couch potato to see the personnel weakness. With the safety or LB in coverage, we would all see the glaring weakness. With an end trying to play nose, it would take a knowledgeable fan to see the guard, who should be tied up with a mountain of a NT, killing the ILB on a run.

The point is, why play a scheme we don't have the personnel for, for any number of snaps?

Would it be good coaching to go heavy personnel last season with DJax and Crowder playing two of the TE positions as long as it was just for a few snaps?

How many snaps per game is it ok to have sub-standard personnel on the field?

I Respectfully AGREE with your thoughts. Well said. The inside of our D was porous, at best last year and some of the reasons given were our guys manning that position were too "small". We didn't do much to improve the size issue during the off season.

But, for the record, I'm not "fretting", that's stuff that wussies do & I'm no wuss.

But I am interested in what will transpire.

What I find really interesting is Tomsula will either coach up a big body to play NT that nobody really expects or Tomsula will coach up a gap splitter, which hasn't been his forte.

So, I am interested in seeing how this will play out.


HTTR.

[Schneed10]

Terrance Knighton was very good at commanding double teams and clogging the middle in his one season here. Yet our defense still blew chunks and he never played in the NFL again after that. So tell me again how a traditional NT is so important in a 3-4 when nobody else in the NFL thought he was worth it?

The Cardinals and Texans are the two teams with the most successful 3-4 defenses over the last few years, I think we would all agree with that. The Texans have Vince Wilfork playing the NT role, a good traditional NT type, but aging. The Cardinals have Corey Peters in that role, a 6-3 305 pounder drafted in the third round by the Falcons.

Notice those defenses have something else in common, strong pass rushers from the end and OLB spots. JJ Watt, Clowney, the since departed Calais Campbell, and Chandler Jones. To say nothing of the secondary play.

I am with Matty, NT is overrated.

[Bangee7]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Terrance Knighton was very good at commanding double teams and clogging the middle in his one season here. Yet our defense still blew chunks and he never played in the NFL again after that. So tell me again how a traditional NT is so important in a 3-4 when nobody else in the NFL thought he was worth it?

The Cardinals and Texans are the two teams with the most successful 3-4 defenses over the last few years, I think we would all agree with that. The Texans have Vince Wilfork playing the NT role, a good traditional NT type, but aging. The Cardinals have Corey Peters in that role, a 6-3 305 pounder drafted in the third round by the Falcons.

Notice those defenses have something else in common, strong pass rushers from the end and OLB spots. JJ Watt, Clowney, the since departed Calais Campbell, and Chandler Jones. To say nothing of the secondary play.

I am with Matty, NT is overrated.

Good points, but nobody will convince me that any position on Defense is not important.

No doubt Knighton was Huge, but as we all saw, he was also over weight & out of shape. When he was on the field, he took too many plays off.

Corey Peters is the interesting outlier in this discussion.
He played 497 of 1,019 (48%) defensive snaps last year for the Cardinals.
So you've proven that the argument that Hood & Ioannidis were too small is not valid. (Rich Tandler should be ashamed!)

So, it sounds like it's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog.

McGee missed 7 games last year & only played 220 of 987 snaps (22%).

Our Defense was pathetic last year (against the run, against the pass) - just pathetic.

It will be interesting to see if the same basic players line up at the same spots & play better.

Maybe scheme & coaching can make that happen...it's something I'll be watching.

[DYoungJelly]

Originally Posted by Schneed10

Terrance Knighton was very good at commanding double teams and clogging the middle in his one season here. Yet our defense still blew chunks and he never played in the NFL again after that. So tell me again how a traditional NT is so important in a 3-4 when nobody else in the NFL thought he was worth it?

The Cardinals and Texans are the two teams with the most successful 3-4 defenses over the last few years, I think we would all agree with that. The Texans have Vince Wilfork playing the NT role, a good traditional NT type, but aging. The Cardinals have Corey Peters in that role, a 6-3 305 pounder drafted in the third round by the Falcons.

Notice those defenses have something else in common, strong pass rushers from the end and OLB spots. JJ Watt, Clowney, the since departed Calais Campbell, and Chandler Jones. To say nothing of the secondary play.

I am with Matty, NT is overrated.

No he wasn't. Terrence knighton was not good at commanding double teams per every Cooley Film breakdown. Try to watch the 2nd philly game of 2015. He was barely doubled at all. He was so bad, he was out of the league the very next year and despite being 30 years old is still unemployed.

Whenever he was legitimately doubled (again philly game) he was washed out of the play so far it affected others around him. He was lazy and could not hold his ground which is exactly the opposite of his assignment.

The only reason I remember that game is I went back with pen and paper and posted about it on here.

Do you have a specific game you are thinking of where he played well or just commenting in general?