Does Ramsey Have Some Trade Control?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by offiss

I agree Daseal, I think the x-factor is going to be Saunders, I believe he will have a major say in who he believes is the best QB to run his offense, and right now it's Patrick, he has all the qualities that you need to be a pocket passer, Green flurished under Saunders in KC he is also very similar to Ramsey except 1, Ramseys arm is much more powerful, and 2, Ramsey is smarter, beyond that they are both tough and probably move about the same.

I don't believe that Brunell has the arm or the toughness to run Saunders offense, but I am also realistic in the fact that Gibbs is going to do his best to push for Brunell, at least early on, then it will be Campbell.

I feel all Ramsey needs is a legitamate shot early on and he will take the job, just don't know if he will be here to do it.

How do you conclude that Ramsey is smarter than Green?

[jordanz301]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

How do you conclude that Ramsey is smarter than Green?

tafkas didnt u hear? the nfl jst took IQ tests to all players and posted them??!?!??!?! and theyre showing there SAT scoresss......

[Huddle]

Originally Posted by 70Chip

I think that Ramsey is an upgrade from Frerotte and Rosenfels and I would press the Dolphins for a #3 in negotiations. I think we can find someone willing to give up a 3 for Patrick. The contract stuff is for them to work out. If a team wants an extension as part of the deal then we move on to the next team.

I think Ramsey would be smart to sign a new deal with the Dolphins, say for three years, heavily weighted toward incentives. If he were willing to do that to make the trade work, I think the Dolphins would consider the three pick a bargain price.

It's interesting to me that hardcore fans who have (presumably) seen every snap Patrick has taken could arrive at such varying opinions of his ability. I see him as extremely average. A strong, accurate thrower, handicapped by his lack of mobility and poor decision making. Others see him as a superstar, who would dazzle us if it weren't for that biased Joe Gibbs, who cares more about proving he wasn't wrong on Brunell than he does about winning.

Well, there are many other positions in between those you mention. I don't have any doubt that Joe sees his Brunell-Ramsey decisions as being best for the team. It isn't an ego thing with him. But my not-so-humble opinion is that he's wrong.

I'm not a stats guy. Most individual statistics are worthless in my book. One exception I make is wins and losses. In 23 starts Ramsey was 10-13 (Chicago start last season not included). Over the same span, the team was 8-17 in games not started by Patrick.

I haven't seen a superstar performance, but Patrick was our best QB over a three year span and, although I'm resigned to his leaving, I think he might still be the best on our roster.

[Huddle]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

How do you conclude that Ramsey is smarter than Green?

I couldn't find Green's Wonderlic score, so we can't say for sure. But Ramsey (32) is smarter than Brunell (22).

Campbell took the test three times. His first score was (14)...bonehead. But then he scored 27 and 28. I don't know how that can happen...too much discrepancy in those scores.

[skinsguy]

Originally Posted by Huddle

I couldn't find Green's Wonderlic score, so we can't say for sure. But Ramsey (32) is smarter than Brunell (22).

How has that translated on the field?

[Huddle]

Originally Posted by skinsguy

How has that translated on the field?

Who knows?

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Let's please not rehash the Brunell-Ramsey-Campbell-Other QB debate. We've done that so many times. Ramsey is leaving. Let's move on.

[Huddle]

Originally Posted by Ramseyfan

Let's please not rehash the Brunell-Ramsey-Campbell-Other QB debate. We've done that so many times. Ramsey is leaving. Let's move on.

Did you read the thread?

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by Huddle

Did you read the thread?

Yes. Unfortunately however, the thread is moving away from discussion about the thread's original topic to who Ramsey is or is not smarter than (i.e. Brunell).

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Ramseyfan

Yes. Unfortunately however, the thread is moving away from discussion about the thread's original topic to who Ramsey is or is not smarter than (i.e. Brunell).

Yeah I apologize for that. That was my fault for questioning how someone concluded that Ramsey is smarter than Trent Green. Mea culpa.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by TAFKAS

Yeah I apologize for that. That was my fault for questioning how someone concluded that Ramsey is smarter than Trent Green. Mea culpa.

We both know it was bound to go there anyways.

[That Guy]

the wonderlic is general IQ test given after hours of workouts, so like the SATs, it is possible to study for them by taking hundreds and hundreds of practice questions a day. Its also possible campbell was suffering from heat exhaustion or some other minor condition that took his focus away from the test.

The test is meant to see how well you can think under pressure, its translation onto a football field has always been debatable.

McNabb did terribly on the wonderlic and he's still a franchise QB (though we now know he's lacking severly in off-field leadership skills).

[Huddle]

Originally Posted by That Guy

the wonderlic is general IQ test given after hours of workouts, so like the SATs, it is possible to study for them by taking hundreds and hundreds of practice questions a day. Its also possible campbell was suffering from heat exhaustion or some other minor condition that took his focus away from the test.

The test is meant to see how well you can think under pressure, its translation onto a football field has always been debatable.

McNabb did terribly on the wonderlic and he's still a franchise QB (though we now know he's lacking severly in off-field leadership skills).

Football isn't rocket science. There isn't anything that someone with a below average IQ can't learn if given enough repetition. It might take him more time, but he'll eventually get there.

Dan Marino scored a 16 on his wonderlic. Jeff George a 10. But low scores like this are the exception rather than the rule for QBs. If two players are about equal in athletic ability, you pick the brighter guy.

Intelligence can make a big difference at cornerback also. Pat Fischer played the game with his brain as much as his body.

[That Guy]

yeah, hence why i mentioned that the results are debateable. Most of the questions are general knowledge or logic problems, not football stuff. If you're below average intelligence you just have to rely/spend more time on rote memorization than drawing conclussion from axioms... but honestly, in any field, actual experience absolutely destroys book learning, and its probably more true in althletics than other fields.

[70Chip]

There are reports that Vince Young scored a 6. I don't think it means much though. I'm sure Pete Carrol would score a lot higher than 6, but he couldn't figure out a way to stop Vince. "Stupid is as stupid does".

Also Jason Campbell doubled his score from 14 his junior year to 28 his senior year. There's not supposed to be that sort of variation in the results. It renders the test suspect as a reliable indicator of intelligence.

On a completely unrelated topic, Dat Nguyen has retired after seven years with Dallas.