What's Wrong with the Redskins?

[Twilbert07]

At the same point in his career last year as JC is this year, Eli Manning won a Super Bowl. Eli is only one year ahead of Campbell, but he is far superior. And as far as the argument that Campbell is in a new system, look at rookie Matt Ryan, who is way ahead of Campbell from a development standpoint in his first year in a new system and new league. Campbell is serviceable, but he does not look like a great QB in the making. He needs to show more leadership on the field.

[SFREDSKIN]

Speaking of Norv and the Chargers. If I was the Chargers after giving Norv his walking papers, I hire Cam Cameron in a heartbeat. Look at the job he's done with Baltimore and say what you will about his experience in Miami, this guy can coach.

[A10sROCK]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

I agree that either JC is "the one or he's not," but I otherwise disagree with your post. You absolutely have to consider what JC is working with. You can't evaluate a QB without looking at the scheme, the receivers, the backs, and the line. Players' careers are made or broken by their surroundings (e.g., compare Randy Moss in 2006 and 2007).

I agree the OL is old and deteriorating. I agree our WR drop balls. I agree when Portis is having a good game, JC can do well. Jason has had good games and under top conditions will be a good QB.

HOWEVER, why can't he ever connect on the long balls? Why have three sets of OC (including a HOF coach, #1 OC and a top notch QB coach) had such limited scoring since Jason started? Why do we have a MPV RB, Clinton Portis, but we score so few points? There's much blame to go around, but the "everyone but Jason" arguments just don't seem right with me.

As I've said - he's earned the chance to start this entire season. Probably well into next year. But eventually we will have to see if [as happened when Collins won 5 games last year] someone else can do it better with the offensive talent we have; if the offense doesn't score more points.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by A10sROCK

I agree the OL is old and deteriorating. I agree our WR drop balls. I agree when Portis is having a good game, JC can do well. Jason has had good games and under top conditions will be a good QB.

HOWEVER, why can't he ever connect on the long balls? Why have three sets of OC (including a HOF coach, #1 OC and a top notch QB coach) had such limited scoring since Jason started? Why do we have a MPV RB, Clinton Portis, but we score so few points? There's much blame to go around, but the "everyone but Jason" arguments just don't seem right with me.

As I've said - he's earned the chance to start this entire season. Probably well into next year. But eventually we will have to see if [as happened when Collins won 5 games last year] someone else can do it better with the offensive talent we have; if the offense doesn't score more points.

I don't absolve Jason of all blame. Jason needs to make his reads and get rid of the ball quicker and improve his accuracy on the short to medium throws. But, on the whole, Jason is a good QB and I believe most of our problems on offense lie with the O-line.

[skinsfan69]

Originally Posted by Twilbert07

At the same point in his career last year as JC is this year, Eli Manning won a Super Bowl. Eli is only one year ahead of Campbell, but he is far superior. And as far as the argument that Campbell is in a new system, look at rookie Matt Ryan, who is way ahead of Campbell from a development standpoint in his first year in a new system and new league. Campbell is serviceable, but he does not look like a great QB in the making. He needs to show more leadership on the field.

1. Eli has been in the same offense since his rookie year
2. Eli has better weapons.
3. Eli has a better o-line.

I agree with you about Ryan. He seems to be a little ahead of JC right now. I'm not sure about way ahead. But you could argue he's ahead of JC.

[A10sROCK]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

I don't absolve Jason of all blame. Jason needs to make his reads and get rid of the ball quicker and improve his accuracy on the short to medium throws. But, on the whole, Jason is a good QB and I believe most of our problems on offense lie with the O-line.

Agree 100%. OL is hurting his reads and rushing him. I really question his long-pass ability - far below the NFL average this year and before - when he has time and the WR was open [like today with ARE].

He's definitely good. Question is whether that's good enough for us to be an elite team.

[JWsleep]

The offense is a work in progress. Until we've got everything down so it's automatic, we're going to struggle against good Ds. Look at the Giants if you want to see how to execute. We do not play at that level. Yet.

JC is part of the problem right now, but I'm still optimistic that he'll be part of the solution as well. He's got the tools and he's got a great QB coach now. Let's see what the final four games bring. In any event, I'd certainly agree with many of you that even if JC is a problem, he's not the biggest worry by a long shot. We don't have an elite O-line, and you need that to go far in this league. Likewise, you need sacks, one way or the other.

For all that, I didn't expect us to win this one, though I thought we'd be more competitive. And it will take a GREAT effort to beat the Ravens right now. But I do think we'll beat Cincy and SF. And the iggles will be a toss up--if we play well, we should win. Not sure if 10 gets us in, but that would still be a very successful season, IMHO. The jury is still out on this one, folks.

[Twilbert07]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

1. Eli has been in the same offense since his rookie year
2. Eli has better weapons.
3. Eli has a better o-line.

I agree with you about Ryan. He seems to be a little ahead of JC right now. I'm not sure about way ahead. But you could argue he's ahead of JC.

Eli does benefit from being in the same offense. As far as weapons, you're right - we have no No. 2 receiver. Randle-El is a No. 3, and our rookies are struggling. Still, Fox showed a stat about JC's QB rating in November for his career. His play falls off quickly oin the second half of the year. Campbell should be getting better, not regressing.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by firstdown

To all the negative people who said we would loose then bitch because we did then "FUCK YOU". What do you even have to bitch about when you could not even pick your own team to win!!!!!!!!

I said we would lose and I hoped we would win. I was ready for a win, I wasn't ready for a humiliating beat down. Don't blame me, blame the Redskins.

[saden1]

Originally Posted by Sheriff Gonna Getcha

I don't absolve Jason of all blame. Jason needs to make his reads and get rid of the ball quicker and improve his accuracy on the short to medium throws. But, on the whole, Jason is a good QB and I believe most of our problems on offense lie with the O-line.

Eli's receivers were making plays for him. Jason was getting his balls dropped. The only thing that pissed me off with him was the clear touchdown he had to Moss if he didn't under-throw the ball. Jason didn't let us down this game, the play caller did with his hunker-down-don't-lose-the-game-hope-we-win bullshit.

[jgalecpa]

Originally Posted by skinsfan69

I agree with you about Ryan. He seems to be a little ahead of JC right now. I'm not sure about way ahead. But you could argue he's ahead of JC.

I'm afraid JC is regressing to his mean QB rating of around 70.

He currently has a 2008 QB rating of 87.8, but that is skewed by some really good games early in the year. The last four games is average qb rating is only 69.25.

Ryan on the other hand has a current qb rating of 91.2, not greatly different from JC's.

HOWEVER, the last four games Ryan's average rating is 107, with none lower than 70.

He is improving as the year goes on, but JC is not.

Blame the line,etc. But as Joe Friday said, those are the facts.

[Sheriff Gonna Getcha]

Originally Posted by jgalecpa

I'm afraid JC is regressing to his mean QB rating of around 70.

He currently has a 2008 QB rating of 87.8, but that is skewed by some really good games early in the year. The last four games is average qb rating is only 69.25.

Blame the line,etc. But as Joe Friday said, those are the facts.

You do realize that in the past three games where Jason had a QB rating under 85, he faced the Cowboys' 8th ranked defense, New York's 3rd ranked defense and the Steelers' 1st ranked defense? Meanwhile, Matt Ryan faced juggernaut defenses like New Orleans' 21st ranked defense, Denver's 27th ranked defense and San Diego's 28th ranked defense. Those too, are the facts.

I realize that Jason has his flaws. However, I also realize that Jason is a decent quarterback and it's absolutely unfair to judge a guy based on a 4 game streak. But, as a Redskins fan, I realize it's par for the course to do so with a Washington QB. We've done it since Gus was backing up Shuler and we'll be doing it until we have the next Peyton Manning. Compared to most Redskins fans, Dan Snyder has the patience of Buddha himself.

[A10sROCK]

Originally Posted by saden1

Eli's receivers were making plays for him. Jason was getting his balls dropped. The only thing that pissed me off with him was the clear touchdown he had to Moss if he didn't under-throw the ball. Jason didn't let us down this game, the play caller did with his hunker-down-don't-lose-the-game-hope-we-win bullshit.

You're blaming Zorn? A rookie coach with a better start than any Redskins HC including Joe Gibbs?

The guy inherited this team. He didn't even get to pick all his coaches. He didn't get to pick all the draft players. I don't agree with all his calls but the mutiple drops, lousy passes, penalties, and poor play against a powerhouse team are not all his fault.

I suppose where the ball is placed for the WR has nothing to do with the drops? Tell me that Zorn told JC to throw a ball into triple coverage? Come on. Zorn has got this team to play above itself.

As others have said, JC QB rating is dropping to his NFL - '75'ish average. I suppose Zorn, Gibbs and Saunders were exclusively responsible for that over the last 4 years.

[MTK]

Placing the blame with JC is just incredibly narrow minded, but yet so typical.

[jbcjr14]

Blah, blah, blah...the SKY IS FALLING!

Alot of football left to be played folks! Keep your heads up and lets hope the Skins can pull some kind of run together.