King predicts Haynesworth to Redskins

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Talk about a fan base scorned by the past, most of the comments here are anti-Big Al calling him fat, lazy, often injured, old, past his prime (don't really get those last two) while the Titans message board (Titans Up The Offer On Haynesworth - TitansOnline.com Message Board) is largely filled with pleas for the Titans to ante up and pay the man. It's interesting that fans who've watched a fat, lazy, often injured, old, past his prime player want him back but we don't want that same player.

For the record, I'm not in the pro-Al camp but it's still kinda funny to see the differences.

That's b/c we can see into the future and know for a fact that Haynesworth is going to be a failure.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

That's b/c we can see into the future and know for a fact that Haynesworth is going to be a failure.

Haynesworth is 28 and historically DTs start declining before they hit 30. They can still be good, but to expect Haynesworth, a huge dude whose been double-teamed for most of his 7 year career, to hold up for the next 5-6 years is utter foolishness. If he didnt have character issues and wasnt considered lazy every year except the last two where he has been playing for a new contract, then we could reasonably expect to get another year or two out of him. however, since he has only played at an elite level the past two years, we have nothing to make us think he'll continue to play that hard when he gets his money. All the odds are stacked in favor of Haynesworth being a disappointment on the team that signs him. Is it possible Haynesworth will continue to play at his 2008 level for the next 2-3years and still play at a high level for 2-3 more after that? sure. but its simply not likely. IMO the odds of that happening given everything ive mentioned above are probably around 0-20%. Without being 100% sure the salary cap will go away in 2010 and never come back again, its simply too great a risk to take.

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

But seriously folks...the other thing that has to be taken into consideration is the future of two of our interior linemen, Montgomery and Golston. One or both could be gone next year. Surprisingly, I've heard that there's more interest in Golston than Montgomery (who I've heard called a young Haynesworth, both because of his potential and inconsistencies in his dedication). But anyway, it's possible we could lose them...and maybe get a couple of 2nd or 3rd rounders in return.

Do you know if we've placed a tender on either of them? The Haynesworth rumors have seriously hurt our leverage if weve been in trade talks with other teams about either of these two guys.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

Haynesworth is 28 and historically DTs start declining before they hit 30. They can still be good, but to expect Haynesworth, a huge dude whose been double-teamed for most of his 7 year career, to hold up for the next 5-6 years is utter foolishness. If he didnt have character issues and wasnt considered lazy every year except the last two where he has been playing for a new contract, then we could reasonably expect to get another year or two out of him. however, since he has only played at an elite level the past two years, we have nothing to make us think he'll continue to play that hard when he gets his money. All the odds are stacked in favor of Haynesworth being a disappointment on the team that signs him. Is it possible Haynesworth will continue to play at his 2008 level for the next 2-3years and still play at a high level for 2-3 more after that? sure. but its simply not likely. IMO the odds of that happening given everything ive mentioned above are probably around 0-20%. Without being 100% sure the salary cap will go away in 2010 and never come back again, its simply too great a risk to take.

Man, you take everything posted here WAYYYY too seriously. Relax :headbange

[44ever]

Originally Posted by Paintrain

Talk about a fan base scorned by the past, most of the comments here are anti-Big Al calling him fat, lazy, often injured, old, past his prime (don't really get those last two) while the Titans message board (Titans Up The Offer On Haynesworth - TitansOnline.com Message Board) is largely filled with pleas for the Titans to ante up and pay the man. It's interesting that fans who've watched a fat, lazy, often injured, old, past his prime player want him back but we don't want that same player.

For the record, I'm not in the pro-Al camp but it's still kinda funny to see the differences.

I think you will see the same reaction to Hall once he hits the market. Hall has been call over rated, trouble maker, nobody wants him. locker room cancer ect... But now that we have showcased him to the entire NFL, watch how fast he goes to the same teams that scorned him previously. And how our fanbase will smacktalk our FO for not getting the deal done. I will be one of them. Not exacly the same argument as AH, but the same theme. But your right it is kinda funny.

As far as AH, well he's the Lawrence Taylor of the Titans. I wouldnt want to see him go either.

[SBXVII]

Ok, I've got a question. Someone at work just informed me that the Skins are reported to be possibly going after Dallas's DE. not Ware but the other one who made the pro bowl. I would think that is the LDE for Dallas and letting Evans go? Has anyone heard it also? My lame source says it was on ESPN. If true would we not have a sick defense; Carter, Haynesworth, Griffin, whoever is Dallas's LDE, Fletcher, Monty, and Taylor, then throw in LL, Horton, CR, and Hall? I just can't imagine how we could do it money wise but if all cylinders worked and there was chemistry.....we probably would have one of the best defenses. again it boils down to money and chemistry.

I'm still looking for the rumor though so don't get your panties in a bunch.

I belive the DE is Canty.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

Ok, I've got a question. Someone at work just informed me that the Skins are reported to be possibly going after Dallas's DE. not Ware but the other one who made the pro bowl. I would think that is the LDE for Dallas and letting Evans go? Has anyone heard it also? My lame source says it was on ESPN. If true would we not have a sick defense; Carter, Haynesworth, Griffin, whoever is Dallas's LDE, Fletcher, Monty, and Taylor, then throw in LL, Horton, CR, and Hall? I just can't imagine how we could do it money wise but if all cylinders worked and there was chemistry.....we probably would have one of the best defenses. again it boils down to money and chemistry.

I'm still looking for the rumor though so don't get your panties in a bunch.

I belive the DE is Canty.

The only place I've heard this is from JLC in Redskins Insider. I just checked ESPN Rumors and PFT, and I haven't seen anything else about this.

[SmootSmack]

You talking about Chris Canty? Yeah, there's a dozen or so posts in multiple threads here that mention this

[SBXVII]

I found this...

NFL Football Rumors - NFL Rumors - National Football League Rumor Central - ESPN

They mention it only on this page but it's under Tues. 24th.

[53Fan]

Originally Posted by SBXVII

I found this...

NFL Football Rumors - NFL Rumors - National Football League Rumor Central - ESPN

They mention it only on this page but it's under Tues. 24th.

They got their information from JLC. JLC gets his information from reading THE WARPATH. Be careful what you post, he'll take it as fact.

[SBXVII]

Originally Posted by 53Fan

They got their information from JLC. JLC gets his information from reading THE WARPATH. Be careful what you post, he'll take it as fact.

Man oh man, now I feel like a dog chasing his own tail.

[freddyg12]

Smoot, how could we get "a couple of 2nd or 3rd rounders in return" for Golston & AM? You think someone would trade that much for them? Sounds high to me.

There's no word of a tender on either. Isn't the deadline near or even passed for that?

[SmootSmack]

The deadline for tendering Montgomery and Golston is Thursday afternoon. From what I understand both are expected to receive 2nd round tenders (that could change I suppose). But anyway, suppose that happens. And like I said I really haven't heard of any team right now that's interested in Montgomery but at least 5 that are interested in Golston. So it's possible, if not probable, that he could be headed elsewhere and we could get a solid draft pick in return. But with RFA tenders, it has nothing to do with any prearranged trades really. It's not like the Redskins are actively shopping either of these guys around. They just know that it's potentially a win-win for them to give both 2nd round tenders.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

The deadline for tendering Montgomery and Golston is Thursday afternoon. From what I understand both are expected to receive 2nd round tenders (that could change I suppose). But anyway, suppose that happens. And like I said I really haven't heard of any team right now that's interested in Montgomery but at least 5 that are interested in Golston. So it's possible, if not probable, that he could be headed elsewhere and we could get a solid draft pick in return. But with RFA tenders, it has nothing to do with any prearranged trades really. It's not like the Redskins are actively shopping either of these guys around. They just know that it's potentially a win-win for them to give both 2nd round tenders.

if we tender both of them for 2nd rounders, and no one else tries to sign them, what are we on the hook for, financially?

We just extended Griff. If we're on the hook in 2009 for Monty and Golston, AND we sign Haynesworth, that strikes me as overkill. I dont know why teams would want Golston over Monty, but maybe i misjudged his potential. Golton did a fine job last year, but i dont think he did anything to prove hes worth a 2nd rounder.

Originally Posted by celts32

Although I like Golston I would do cartwheels to get a 2nd round pick for him. That seems like a lot of compenstation for him and I wonder if it would scare off those 5 teams who like him.

well i honestly wouldnt want to let him go for less. id rather have golston than take a gamble on what vinny would do with a 3rd or 4th round pick.

[freddyg12]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

The deadline for tendering Montgomery and Golston is Thursday afternoon. From what I understand both are expected to receive 2nd round tenders (that could change I suppose). But anyway, suppose that happens. And like I said I really haven't heard of any team right now that's interested in Montgomery but at least 5 that are interested in Golston. So it's possible, if not probable, that he could be headed elsewhere and we could get a solid draft pick in return. But with RFA tenders, it has nothing to do with any prearranged trades really. It's not like the Redskins are actively shopping either of these guys around. They just know that it's potentially a win-win for them to give both 2nd round tenders.

thanks, knew you'd have an explanation. I'd forgotten about the tender for rfa's as a means of trade facilitation.

I hope both are back here & maybe next season both can get decent deals to stay. Neither is a star but both have proven capable of starting & playing solid gap control.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

The deadline for tendering Montgomery and Golston is Thursday afternoon. From what I understand both are expected to receive 2nd round tenders (that could change I suppose). But anyway, suppose that happens. And like I said I really haven't heard of any team right now that's interested in Montgomery but at least 5 that are interested in Golston. So it's possible, if not probable, that he could be headed elsewhere and we could get a solid draft pick in return. But with RFA tenders, it has nothing to do with any prearranged trades really. It's not like the Redskins are actively shopping either of these guys around. They just know that it's potentially a win-win for them to give both 2nd round tenders.

Montgomery looks just a little bit out of place in our defense (it's not that he doesn't dominate, it's that his weaknesses sometimes get exposed simply by his positioning). He's a prototype 3-4 nose (although you might want a more consistent player in that position if you are an exclusive 3-4 defense), but is a pretty decent 4-3 nose. Unfortunately, I think that's the position Albert Haynesworth plays in the Tennessee defense.

Montgomery isn't very adaptable within the confines of our defense. Neither is Golston frankly. Both guys are line 'em up over the ball types who can create a lot of havoc against the run (and in Monty's case, the pass as well). If we get Haynesworth, there's no point to bringing them both back. No reason at all.

Either way, Griffin still has the keystone role in the defense, because he's that three technique that is so important in the run fit schemes that Blache plays. I'm sure Haynesworth could play the same position just fine, but he would lose some of his value if we move him off the nose.

I feel like I'm talking as if Haynesworth is already a done deal, which I don't believe at all, but I'm seeing a Haynesworth-Griffin combination next year whcih is 1) very, very good, but also 2) going to block the younger talent we need to develop.

Best case scenario, is that someone in need of a 4-3 nose signs Golston to an offer sheet and we just let him go. Then we get the second rounder back, and actually have gained some pass rushing ability in the whole process. Otherwise, if we get Haynesworth, we have a bench full of starter-quality young talent with no place to get on the field.