How long do you keep Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly if they don't produce?

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by 70Chip

You worried they can't catch 40 passes? Have I set the bar too high? Are you worried they can't get on the field ahead of Moss and Randle-El? Then why did we draft them? Hell they can't get on the field ahead of Thrash.

And sorry about the language I was paraphrasing a character from a film. I figured that if Alec Baldwin can say it, it must be okay.

I don't know the actual numbers but how often do the #3 and #4 receivers each get 40 catches. (I'm working under the assumption that Moss and Cooley are essentially 1 and 2)

[70Chip]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I don't know the actual numbers but how often do the #3 and #4 receivers each get 40 catches. (I'm working under the assumption that Moss and Cooley are essentially 1 and 2)

This is what I don't get. Why did we spend two high draft picks on #3 and #4 receivers? We already had #3 and #4 receivers. With their size and athleticism, one of them should be the #1 receiver. When they chosen, I don't remember anyone saying, "Good. We finally have those #3 and #4 receivers, we've been wanting". No. The talk was all about how Santana would handle being demoted.

[steveo395]

Originally Posted by 70Chip

This is what I don't get. Why did we spend two high draft picks on #3 and #4 receivers? We already had #3 and #4 receivers. With their size and athleticism, one of them should be the #1 receiver. When they chosen, I don't remember anyone saying, "Good. We finally have those #3 and #4 receivers, we've been wanting". No. The talk was all about how Santana would handle being demoted.

They are only expected to be #3 and #4 receivers this year. Hopefully one of them will be able to become a #1, but most likely it is not going to happen this year. It takes time.

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by 70Chip

This is what I don't get. Why did we spend two high draft picks on #3 and #4 receivers? We already had #3 and #4 receivers. With their size and athleticism, one of them should be the #1 receiver. When they chosen, I don't remember anyone saying, "Good. We finally have those #3 and #4 receivers, we've been wanting". No. The talk was all about how Santana would handle being demoted.

Well, I don't know that we needed to add essentially three WRs. But I think the goal was to get a strong #2 to enhance Moss' presence as the #1 WR. That said, I personally think the should move Moss out of here a year too early rather than a year too late.

But I sort of envision (hope?) that this season, by the end of the first month, Kelly is firmly entrenched as the #2 WR. Sort of like the Keyshawn Johnson type that gets a lot of key catches, while DT is the gamebreaker. Not as many catches, but big plays.

Thrash should be gone. And yeah I have no idea where ARE falls into it all. And that doesn't even take into account Cooley or Davis...or Portis for that matter.

[70Chip]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Well, I don't know that we needed to add essentially three WRs. But I think the goal was to get a strong #2 to enhance Moss' presence as the #1 WR. That said, I personally think the should move Moss out of here a year too early rather than a year too late.

But I sort of envision (hope?) that this season, by the end of the first month, Kelly is firmly entrenched as the #2 WR. Sort of like the Keyshawn Johnson type that gets a lot of key catches, while DT is the gamebreaker. Not as many catches, but big plays.

Thrash should be gone. And yeah I have no idea where ARE falls into it all. And that doesn't even take into account Cooley or Davis...or Portis for that matter.

I hope they both turn out to be great. I hope you get to rub it in my face because if they do play well, we will be a solid team. To me, WR was by far our greatest weakness. If we could have averaged 24 or 25 points a game last year(which is good but not great), we would have won 11 or 12 easily. Maybe more.

I agree about Thrash. I hate to see him go, but if he's still here next season, it's a bad sign.

As for Moss, I think he has a couple of seasons left, IF he is not the primary weapon. If you have another threat at WR, Moss has the potential to blow up at any time because of single coverage. He's still has explosiveness. It might allow him to be healthier and fresher for the end of the season.

[GMScud]

GTripp will argue ARE's contributions big time.

Thrash is true leader. In fact, it's my understanding that Thrash and ARE are the two biggest spiritual leaders on the team. I get it that on the field production is ultimately what matters, but I think it losing Thrash and eventually ARE will hurt the locker room.

It's an interesting topic really. Gibbs was all about the locker room. Our best leaders are arguably Randy Thomas, James Thrash, ARE, and Fletcher. All of those guys are nearing the end of their tenures with the Redskins I think. We're going to need some new leaders to emerge sooner rather than later.

[GTripp0012]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

Well, I don't know that we needed to add essentially three WRs. But I think the goal was to get a strong #2 to enhance Moss' presence as the #1 WR. That said, I personally think the should move Moss out of here a year too early rather than a year too late.

But I sort of envision (hope?) that this season, by the end of the first month, Kelly is firmly entrenched as the #2 WR. Sort of like the Keyshawn Johnson type that gets a lot of key catches, while DT is the gamebreaker. Not as many catches, but big plays.

Thrash should be gone. And yeah I have no idea where ARE falls into it all. And that doesn't even take into account Cooley or Davis...or Portis for that matter.

The fact that we didn't try to extend Santana's deal is pretty damning evidence to the fact that the team is leaving their options open if not actively shopping him though.

I thought he might yield a second round pick, but next year will be his age 30 season, and the market is absolutely flooded with veteran WRs, most of which are more consistent and less injury prone than Moss.

So with that said, its hard for me to see a situation where we get fair value for Moss, at least before the draft. If anything, a draft day deal seems most likely.

The fact that Golston got the 2nd round tender makes it really obvious that they intend to deal him at some point this offseason.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by GTripp0012

The fact that we didn't try to extend Santana's deal is pretty damning evidence to the fact that the team is leaving their options open if not actively shopping him though.

I thought he might yield a second round pick, but next year will be his age 30 season, and the market is absolutely flooded with veteran WRs, most of which are more consistent and less injury prone than Moss.

So with that said, its hard for me to see a situation where we get fair value for Moss, at least before the draft. If anything, a draft day deal seems most likely.

The fact that Golston got the 2nd round tender makes it really obvious that they intend to deal him at some point this offseason.

Well New England did trade a 5th round pick for Greg Lewis. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Santana Moss is much better than Greg Lewis (who's the same age as Santana) and would be worth a higher round pick. Now at this point I don't think he should be traded of course.

[Zerohero]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I don't know the actual numbers but how often do the #3 and #4 receivers each get 40 catches. (I'm working under the assumption that Moss and Cooley are essentially 1 and 2)

From his comments i think the point is kelly and thomas should be passing thrash and randel in the depth chart. So by seasons end if these guys arent the 2nd and 3rd option something is wrong. Them maturing and campbell being in the second year of the same offense we can expect those numbers.

[Redskin Jim]

Originally Posted by Zerohero

From his comments i think the point is kelly and thomas should be passing thrash and randel in the depth chart. So by seasons end if these guys arent the 2nd and 3rd option something is wrong. Them maturing and campbell being in the second year of the same offense we can expect those numbers.

Bingo! That is what they were brought in to do... Time to step up boys...

[GMScud]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I don't know the actual numbers but how often do the #3 and #4 receivers each get 40 catches. (I'm working under the assumption that Moss and Cooley are essentially 1 and 2)

So where would Randle El fit in? I don't think anyone should expect Moss, Cooley, Thomas, Kelly, and Randle El to all be real contributors. Moss and Cooley of course. The other three? We shall see. Don't forget Zorn has repeatedly said he really wants to get Fred Davis involved too.

[Zerohero]

Originally Posted by GMScud

So where would Randle El fit in? I don't think anyone should expect Moss, Cooley, Thomas, Kelly, and Randle El to all be real contributors. Moss and Cooley of course. The other three? We shall see. Don't forget Zorn has repeatedly said he really wants to get Fred Davis involved too.

Thats kind of the point, Randel El will no longer be used if the young guys improve. If only Moss could return all the punts too...

[Skinny Tee]

Originally Posted by Zerohero

Thats kind of the point, Randel El will no longer be used if the young guys improve. If only Moss could return all the punts too...

Keep in mind that Randle El restructured his contract this past offseason along with Andre Carter.

He got a new signing bonus and a longer contract to lessen his number against the cap. That means management believes he'll be used in this offense for the next two or three years and not just for punts.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Zerohero

Thats kind of the point, Randel El will no longer be used if the young guys improve. If only Moss could return all the punts too...

Maybe ARE would be a better punt returner if that were his only job.

[Redskin Jim]

Originally Posted by Lotus

Maybe ARE would be a better punt returner if that were his only job.

Not likely.. ARE is done as a punt returner, mark my words, D. Thomas or the new kid from the cfl is the wave of the future.. I really like ARE as a Skin but his days are numbered.. don't count on him to be here after this season.