Haynesworth is Behaving Selfishly

[Defensewins]

The Redskins did measure the trade value of several of their contracted players like JC, CP, AH, etc by talking trade with other teams. When they saw they were not going get what they wanted for certain players they moved on. The fans and the media did not.

The LeBron and Cleveland situation reminds me a lot of the AH situation, only in that the media and fans in Cleveland said some really insulting things about LeBron out of anger and frustration after the final loss in Cleveland. I could not believe some of the things that were said in the media about a fairly decent guy that tries/plays hard and really wants to win a championship. Cleveland fans and media might have shot themselves in the foot, because they want and financially need him to come back. The ironic thing is now that the fans and media have spewed their venom, why would LeBron want to come back to Cleveland?

[BigHairedAristocrat]

I like how Allen says "a lot" of the reports out there about trading Haynesworth aren't true. He didnt deny that some of them were.

I don't think any reasonable person doubts that if a team offered the right compensation for AH, he'd be gone and Allen and Shanahan would be pretty happy about it. But at this point, every team in the NFL has had a chance to offer the right compensation and, obviously, they were either unwilling or unable to meet our demands. The only way he gets moved in 2010 is if a stud DT on a "contending" team suffers a season-ending injury and the team panics. Baring that, Haynesworth should be here through 2010.

From Haynesworth's side, I am not backing down from my opinion that, having just received a 20MM check, he should be willing to do whatever the team asks him to do. We know that, at minimum, he has rebuffed Shanahan's, Hasletts, Allens, Phillip Danie'ls, and Donovan F. McNabb's requests/pleadings that he show up like everyone else. All will be forgiven if Haynesworth shows up for mandatory activities, gives 100% at whatever role his coaches assign him, and dominates during the regular season. But right now, those are very high expectations and Haynesworth's absence makes him look like a primadonna who care's more about himself than the team. Again, nothing we didn't know before signing him. Right now, we're getting what we paid for.

It is a legitimate story, and the media is doing their job by continuing to report on it. I don't think either JLC, the WaPo, PFT, or any other major media outlet is "making stuff up" by reporting what their sources are telling him. This won't go away until Haynesworth is traded or he starts participating in team activities.

[Ruhskins]

Originally Posted by BigHairedAristocrat

I don't think any reasonable person doubts that if a team offered the right compensation for AH, he'd be gone and Allen and Shanahan would be pretty happy about it. But at this point, every team in the NFL has had a chance to offer the right compensation and, obviously, they were either unwilling or unable to meet our demands. The only way he gets moved in 2010 is if a stud DT on a "contending" team suffers a season-ending injury and the team panics. Baring that, Haynesworth should be here through 2010.

I'm just curious to know what are your thoughts about the change to the 3-4 (without thinking about AH). Part of me wants to somewhat agree with folks that are saying what you are saying.

But my logical side is telling me that it is a bad idea to switch to the 3-4. That making this switch is creating needs on defense that we didn't have before and that it seems that this new coaching staff is willing to gamble in making several players on defense play a new position. With this in mind, it is a bit hard to ignore AH saying that he wants to play a position that will make him more effective.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by Ruhskins

I'm just curious to know what are your thoughts about the change to the 3-4 (without thinking about AH). Part of me wants to somewhat agree with folks that are saying what you are saying.

But my logical side is telling me that it is a bad idea to switch to the 3-4. That making this switch is creating needs on defense that we didn't have before and that it seems that this new coaching staff is willing to gamble in making several players on defense play a new position. With this in mind, it is a bit hard to ignore AH saying that he wants to play a position that will make him more effective.

I think switching to a 3-4 base defense in 2010 is completely retarded. We had a Top 10 defense in 2010 with a uber-conservative DC that had two of our top potential playmakers playing out of position (3 if you want to include misusing haynesworth). Additionally, the defense was also hurt because our innept offense couldnt score points and the HC made stupid calls that constantly put our defense in tough spots.

Shanahan's offense and play-calling alone would indirectly improve our defense. Move Landry to SS, Orakpo to full-time 4-3 DE, and let Hasletts more aggressive calling work its magic. In my mind, those changes alone would make our defense top 5. Instead, I don't see any way our defense is not in the bottom 10 of the league in 2010. we've simply got too many guys on the roster who don't really fit anywhere in the system and/or who are playing out of their natural position now. IMO Haynesworth is, by far, the best player on our defense, if not the entire team, and the coaches should be doing everything as possible to get the most out of him. Shanahan and Hasletts forcing the 3-4 on the team now is no different than Cerrato forcing the WCO on Jason Campbell. Its a square peg and a round hole. Eventually, you can make it ok, but the coaches are just making a problem when there doesnt need to be one. Great coaches are supposed to adapt their systems to their personnel. All teams run a little bit of everything to confuses offenses, and i'm not averse to the team going to a base 3-4 eventually. But doing it in 2010 is just further evidence that Shanahan is still a moron when it comes to defense.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by artmonkforhallofamein07

Good god. If that is the way DS handles his football business there is no wonder why we sucked and were never rewarded with the big payoff from signing these types of guys. As another note, for the player to think that he can come in and have the owner tell the staff what to do with so and so player, really takes the coaching aspect out of things. Wonder why there has been no way to get these guys to gell? Or for that matter why we couldn't win? The Zorn and Blache experiment was doomed from the word go under that logic. No when Gibbs 2.0 ran things we were a little more organized.

Now that we have gotten rid of the dead weight and Synder turned the team over to people who really know wtf they are doing, we may finally have some success. I pray that we do so Synder learn that he needs to keep his little hands off the football team and let the guys who know how to run an organization handle the football side of things. He can still pump the Redskins Propaganda but at least now we do have some hope for a brighter future as a respectible franchise.

Even under Gibbs 2.0 things were a little laxed at Redskins Park. Again, Jason Reid was talking about how under Jim Zorn players would be in the weight room very chatty and not really into it. Under Shanny it's more intense, focused, and the climate has definitely shifted. I don't think anyone is suggesting that players didn't workout under Zorn or Gibbs, but I get the sense that they were going through the motions and just punching the clock.

The one thing that I keep hearing over and over again is that for the first time in a long time, perhaps since Snyder has owned the team, there is an air of professionalism at Redskins Park. They are actually run like an NFL organization from top to bottom, and they're not doing things and bringing in players by the seat of their pants. Bruce Allen has plan in place; Shanahan has a plan in place.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Even under Gibbs 2.0 things were a little laxed at Redskins Park. Again, Jason Reid was talking about how under Jim Zorn players would be in the weight room very chatty and not really into it. Under Shanny it's more intense, focused, and the climate has definitely shifted. I don't think anyone is suggesting that players didn't workout under Zorn or Gibbs, but I get the sense that they were going through the motions and just punching the clock.

The one thing that I keep hearing over and over again is that for the first time in a long time, perhaps since Snyder has owned the team, there is an air of professionalism at Redskins Park. They are actually run like an NFL organization from top to bottom, and they're not doing things and bringing in players by the seat of their pants. Bruce Allen has plan in place; Shanahan has a plan in place.

Agreed. Its a nice starting point.

[over the mountain]

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

good points

[MTK]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Even under Gibbs 2.0 things were a little laxed at Redskins Park. Again, Jason Reid was talking about how under Jim Zorn players would be in the weight room very chatty and not really into it. Under Shanny it's more intense, focused, and the climate has definitely shifted. I don't think anyone is suggesting that players didn't workout under Zorn or Gibbs, but I get the sense that they were going through the motions and just punching the clock.

The one thing that I keep hearing over and over again is that for the first time in a long time, perhaps since Snyder has owned the team, there is an air of professionalism at Redskins Park. They are actually run like an NFL organization from top to bottom, and they're not doing things and bringing in players by the seat of their pants. Bruce Allen has plan in place; Shanahan has a plan in place.

I'm paraphrasing, but I read a NFL.com chat the other day with JLC and he said the Skins are a real organization again from the top down thanks to Allen/Shanahan. He said the sleeping giant is awake.

[over the mountain]

yeah this is an exciting time. for the first time in 11 years our coach is not 1) an interim coach (robiskie) 2) a lazy college coach trying to make the transition to the nfl (spurrier) 3) has not been out of the nfl in every capacity for a decade (gibbs) 4) is not a last resort option and placeholder (zorn).

really marty was the only legit coach we had. while he went 0-6, he did go 6-0 to end the season.

im really really excited. coaching is huge in the nfl imo. more so than hockey, baseball and basketball combined.

[BigHairedAristocrat]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

I guess that's my main issue. Given our current roster, switching to a 3-4 now makes no sense. Switching to a 3-4 makes sense when a team is young. However, the vast majority of our defense is at or past its prime.
In three years, when the "real" part of Haynesworth's contract is up, and Andre Carter, London Fletcher, and Phillip Daniels have all retired would seem to be the ideal time to siwtch... if we even decided to switch. I know the 3-4 defense is "trendy" right now, but its not like the 4-3 defense is obsolete.

To me, it seems like we're forcing the 3-4 just for the sake of having it. With the potential exception of Orakpo, every single defensive starter and the majority of our backups from 2009 is a prototypical 4-3 defensive player. Whereas before, we had great depth with guys like Lorenzo Alexander, Chris Wilson, and Jeremy Jarmon, now I wonder if any of these guys will even be on the team in 2011. Seems like an awful waste of existing talent to me.

However, I do agree that we will probably not run as much 3-4 as most "3-4" teams. I honestly wouldnt be surprised if we pretty much only play 3-4 when Haynesworth is "injured" or taking a breather.

[NYCskinfan82]

Originally Posted by over the mountain

well, if we are going to switch to a 3-4, i think it is going to take a year or so to implement the system and turn over the personel to fit the 3-4.

its going to take atleast a year to make the switch, so why not do it this year when we are in a full flux of change. That way, next year, we already went through the transition period and am ready to roll full steam with the 3-4 in 2011.

plus, it seems we are going to ease our way into the 3-4, not commit fully to the scheme this year.

We don't have the personnel yet so net year when we go out and get the personnel we will have to teach the system again.

[over the mountain]

idk, i dont think anyones opinion on this is wrong. but i do believe shanny, allen and haslett have personally placed a 3-5 year window of achieving success here.

if they believe that the 3-4 is the superior D scheme, i understand their interest in implementing it right away (or atleast starting to ease into it) so that 2-3 years from now they can reasonably expect success vs waiting 2-3 years when fletch, Ah are gone then trying to implement the 3-4.

From day one when allen got here it was apparent we are working and will do everything we can to be a consistent contender in a year or two, if not right now.

waiting 2-3 years for the older vets on our roster to be gone would waste 2-3 years orakpo, jarmon and others could be learning. orakpo is going to be a cornerstone of our D for years to come, getting him used to outside 3-4 is important.

i dont see why we cant introduce the scheme, use it soemtimes in real live action and make methodical decisions re. the new players we bring in.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by Mattyk

I'm paraphrasing, but I read a NFL.com chat the other day with JLC and he said the Skins are a real organization again from the top down thanks to Allen/Shanahan. He said the sleeping giant is awake.

I guess what I'm most encouraged about, as weird as this may sound, is that even if we don't have a stellar season, it won't be due to incompetence. I have a feeling that teams will actually have to outplay the Redskins to beat them this year. You have to figure this team is at least 3 games better than last years squad.

We'll have our share of injuries, set backs or what have you, but we'll also go into game more prepared and ready to compete. Last year it was anyone's guess which Redskins would show up from one week to the next. To me that was most frustrating thing about the Zorn era, and to a lesser extent the Gibbs 2.0. We were never Detroit or Oakland bad, but we struggled with those bastards week in and week out. Along those lines, I think Donovan McNabb brings a dimension of game day readiness that we've lacked for years at the quarterback position. There's not too much that's going to surprise this guy in the NFC East this year.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by NYCskinfan82

We don't have the personnel yet so net year when we go out and get the personnel we will have to teach the system again.

We aren't going to get all the personnel on defense next year, and the ones who succeed and stay will help those coming in grasp the concept.

I have no idea about the rightness/wrongness of transitioning to a 3-4, and I'm waiting to see about Haslett. BUT, Green Bay last year was in the exact same predicament, and they went ahead with the transition, and had a pretty good D. We have some players on our team, and regardless of system, they are going to bring it every game, Orakpo, Fletch, (I say) AH, Rodgers will stop the WR, Hall will pick some balls off. Our D can be effective, in transition, and then we will re-evaluate after our last game in February