Most Overrated NFL Player?

[ST21]

sure thing...but anyway, i don't care if anyone agrees, i said because i'm not trying to hide behind, or saying that this person is dumb and this person is great, if tarkenton, went to 4 superbowl, good i like him, but he was not a traditional qb either, at the end of Vick career, then we will se where he ranks, you wanna talk about overrated players ...................................

Randel Cunningham......there you go

[wolfeskins]

Bigskinbauer
you mentioned ben roethlesburger as being overrated and i totaly agree.
sports people were cumming all over themselves last season when the name big ben was mentioned. i think we all saw the real ben during thier loss in the playoffs.

[skinsfanthru&thru]

i don't know if he's at the top of my list but Matt Hasselback sure came back great from that pro bowl year he had out of no where As far as underrated from the skins I'd have to say my choice would be Cooley. We as skins fans know who he is but it doesn't seem to register with those outside of that and I think that has to do with the fact that he's not really counted as a TE but instead a RB/FB even in fantasy football leagues. As far as overreated skin, I'd have to say its Samuels for me especially with the price tag he carries.

[jacobyfan]

Red Robert, as far as comparing Dilfer to Namath, I don't think I should even touch that. It's like comparing apples to elephants.

Wewhite, Tarkenton was in the top 10 in the league in rushing touchdowns, passing yards, passing touchdowns, and yards per pass attempt in ALL of his first 4 seasons. Vick was in the top 10 in yards per pass (8th) in 2002. That's it. He is NOWHERE CLOSE to Tarkenton. Not in the same ball park. For Cunningham, he was in the top 10 in passing yards and passing TDs in his third and fourth years and made the pro bowl in his fourth (1988). Also way better than Vick. So I will now make my case. Tarkenton and Cunningham were both one of the leagues top 10 QBs early in their careers. Tarkenton right away and Cunningham in his 3rd and 4th year. Vick IS NOT a top 10 QB. The list of comparisons between these three end at: 1. They ran a lot 2. They were QBs.

In summary,
Vick has:

1. More potential than any QB the league has ever seen
2. Wheels for legs and uncanny scrambling ability
3. Little ability to find open recievers
4. Little ability to read defenses

Vick needs:

1. To learn to stay in the pocket
2. Platform shoes (his 6'0" height may be part of his problem with field vision)
3. To learn what "touch" means (maybe he and Ramsey could attend a seminar together)
4. Possibly a little more time. He's a raw talent who came out early. He gets a couple more years in my book. If he doesn't get better he will permanently join the ranks of "most overhyped of all time" in my book.

[MTK]

Originally Posted by jacobyfan

Red Robert, as far as comparing Dilfer to Namath, I don't think I should even touch that. It's like comparing apples to elephants.

Wewhite, Tarkenton was in the top 10 in the league in rushing touchdowns, passing yards, passing touchdowns, and yards per pass attempt in ALL of his first 4 seasons. Vick was in the top 10 in yards per pass (8th) in 2002. That's it. He is NOWHERE CLOSE to Tarkenton. Not in the same ball park. For Cunningham, he was in the top 10 in passing yards and passing TDs in his third and fourth years and made the pro bowl in his fourth (1988). Also way better than Vick. So I will now make my case. Tarkenton and Cunningham were both one of the leagues top 10 QBs early in their careers. Tarkenton right away and Cunningham in his 3rd and 4th year. Vick IS NOT a top 10 QB. The list of comparisons between these three end at: 1. They ran a lot 2. They were QBs.

In summary,
Vick has:

1. More potential than any QB the league has ever seen
2. Wheels for legs and uncanny scrambling ability
3. Little ability to find open recievers
4. Little ability to read defenses

Vick needs:

1. To learn to stay in the pocket
2. Platform shoes (his 6'0" height may be part of his problem with field vision)
3. To learn what "touch" means (maybe he and Ramsey could attend a seminar together)
4. Possibly a little more time. He's a raw talent who came out early. He gets a couple more years in my book. If he doesn't get better he will permanently join the ranks of "most overhyped of all time" in my book.

nice post

[ST21]

really, that was a nice post, but let vick play those many years before you say hes not that close, 3 years compared to what 12-14 years im guessing, my point is let him put in work, before we say he's overrated, seriously out of all the guys in the league, he is the most overrated....i just can't see it......................that was alittle cleaner, and there was no racism in it,

[ST21]

These are fran stats:

+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| Year TM | G | Comp Att PCT YD Y/A TD INT | Att Yards TD |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| 1961 min | 14 | 157 280 56.1 1997 7.1 18 17 | 56 308 5 |
| 1962 min | 14 | 163 329 49.5 2595 7.9 22 25 | 41 361 2 |
| 1963 min | 14 | 170 297 57.2 2311 7.8 15 15 | 28 162 1 |
| 1964 min | 14 | 171 306 55.9 2506 8.2 22 11 | 50 330 2 |
| 1965 min | 14 | 171 329 52.0 2609 7.9 19 11 | 56 356 1 |
| 1966 min | 14 | 192 358 53.6 2561 7.2 17 16 | 62 376 4 |
| 1967 nyg | 14 | 204 377 54.1 3088 8.2 29 19 | 44 306 2 |
| 1968 nyg | 14 | 182 337 54.0 2555 7.6 21 12 | 57 301 3 |
| 1969 nyg | 14 | 220 409 53.8 2918 7.1 23 8 | 37 172 0 |
| 1970 nyg | 14 | 219 389 56.3 2777 7.1 19 12 | 43 236 2 |
| 1971 nyg | 13 | 226 386 58.5 2567 6.7 11 21 | 30 111 3 |
| 1972 min | 14 | 215 378 56.9 2651 7.0 18 13 | 27 180 0 |
| 1973 min | 14 | 169 274 61.7 2113 7.7 15 7 | 41 202 1 |
| 1974 min | 13 | 199 351 56.7 2598 7.4 17 12 | 21 120 2 |
| 1975 min | 14 | 273 425 64.2 2994 7.0 25 13 | 16 108 2 |
| 1976 min | 13 | 255 412 61.9 2961 7.2 17 8 | 27 45 1 |
| 1977 min | 9 | 155 258 60.1 1734 6.7 9 14 | 15 6 0 |
| 1978 min | 16 | 345 572 60.3 3468 6.1 25 32 | 24 -6 1 |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+
| TOTAL | 246 | 3686 6467 57.0 47003 7.3 342 266 | 675 3674 32 |
+----------+-----+---------------------------------------+-----------------+

and these are Vick Stats


PASSING

Year Team G GS Att Comp Pct Yards YPA Lg TD Int Tkld 20+ 40+ Rate
2001 Atlanta Falcons 8 2 113 50 44.2 785 6.95 52 2 3 21/113 11 4 62.7
2002 Atlanta Falcons 15 15 421 231 54.9 2936 6.97 74 16 8 33/206 44 8 81.6
2003 Atlanta Falcons 5 4 100 50 50.0 585 5.85 49 4 3 9/64 7 2 69.0
2004 Atlanta Falcons 15 15 321 181 56.4 2313 7.21 62 14 12 46/266 35 8 78.1
TOTAL 43 36 955 512 53.6 6619 6.93 74 36 26 109/649 97 22 76.9


RUSHING

Year Team G GS Att Yards Avg Lg TD 20+ FD
2001 Atlanta Falcons 8 2 31 289 9.3 35 1 6 15
2002 Atlanta Falcons 15 15 113 777 6.9 46 8 10 44
2003 Atlanta Falcons 5 4 40 255 6.4 43 1 2 14
2004 Atlanta Falcons 15 15 120 902 7.5 58 3 10 49
TOTAL 43 36 304 2223 7.3 58 13 28 122

[saden1]

What's being debated here? You remove Vick the Falcon's lineup and you'll end up with an infinitely shittier team. If I'm an Atlanta fan Vick is god!

Also the game has changed so much since the 60's-70's. Frankly, you can't compare players from that era to this one.

[offiss]

Originally Posted by saden1

What's being debated here? You remove Vick the Falcon's lineup and you'll end up with an infinitely shittier team. If I'm an Atlanta fan Vick is god!

Also the game has changed so much since the 60's-70's. Frankly, you can't compare players from that era to this one.

Really???????????????

You don't think a QB who can throw the ball downfield would be an improvement?

The Eagles proved that if you contain Vick rollout he's lost.

[BigSKINBauer]

wolfe i definatley agree with big ben i mean he had a great supporting cast and for some reason it felt as if the steelers always FOUND a way to win. Yah that is great but it was always something little and pissed me off, i like underdog teams and i always want winning teams to lose some. Some examples, that game against Jacksonville if anyone remembers Cowher(prolly not right spelling) killing the clock at 18 seconds to kick a field goal to take the lead, he could have wasted more time and then jags come back to kick a long field goal like 60 yards, and they barely missed it. I thought that was a stupid coaching move but the media made it sound like when roethlisburger spiked the ball he was playing smart and vetern football. Some other games they could have lost were the cowboys and Jets in playoffs and ofcourse us.
Roethlisburger had ALL the help he could ask for on Defense and they ran the ball more than anyother team in league i believe. But to his credit he did what he was supposed to when he was supposed to but he was in a great possition. Also has any QB in history not made the probowl with 14 wins, I think he started 13 and team won 15.

Vick- in a sense he is overrated but in a sense he is not. See no one thinks of him as a great thrower or great "traditional" QB. We think of him as exiting, and fun to watch, great on his feet, and the fastest QB in history. IN my opinion someone has to MISUNDERSTOOD to be overrated, I think he gets all the credit for being a great runner and it is deserved. But also he gets the deserving discredit of being a bad passer. People buy his shoes because they want to be like him, they want to be fast. He is not the best QB in the league or in my opinion even top 5, no order Mcnabb, Brady, Manning, Culpepper, Farve(still the man but he getting to old for this)

Vick accounted for 902 yards on the ground and 2313 in the air a nice 3215 yards TOTAL. but 14 Qbs in the league threw for more than that many yards(3215 VIck's total), so right now i see no reason for him being in the HOF as of now. culpepper threw for more than 1500 yards more than vicks TOTAL. Kerry collins and Testeverde both got more than 3200 yards. That shows Vick isn't GOD. He is the Most Valuable Player to that team more so than anyother player to any team. But being a great QB= OVERRATED!

[jacobyfan]

Originally Posted by saden1

What's being debated here? You remove Vick the Falcon's lineup and you'll end up with an infinitely shittier team. If I'm an Atlanta fan Vick is god!

Also the game has changed so much since the 60's-70's. Frankly, you can't compare players from that era to this one.

That is why I compared each to the OTHER players in the league at the time e.g. being in the top 10 in a category in order to rate them.

[jacobyfan]

Originally Posted by BigSKINBauer

Vick accounted for 902 yards on the ground and 2313 in the air a nice 3215 yards TOTAL. but 14 Qbs in the league threw for more than that many yards(3215 VIck's total), so right now i see no reason for him being in the HOF as of now. culpepper threw for more than 1500 yards more than vicks TOTAL. Kerry collins and Testeverde both got more than 3200 yards. That shows Vick isn't GOD. He is the Most Valuable Player to that team more so than anyother player to any team. But being a great QB= OVERRATED!

I think with a player like a Collins, Ferrotte, maybe Testaverde from a couple years ago that the Falcons still make the playoffs. The rest of the team is so good on D and runs the ball so well, I thenk they'd be fine. Understand that the point of being able to run is to add a dual threat. The defense can't blitz as much and can't run as heavy coverages because of the threat to run. However, for that to REALLY work like it should, you have to be able to pass. Ever wonder why Crumpler is the one always getting the ball? People are running spy coverages with LBs to keep Vick from taking off.

[jacobyfan]

Originally Posted by wewhite3

really, that was a nice post, but let vick play those many years before you say hes not that close, 3 years compared to what 12-14 years im guessing, my point is let him put in work, before we say he's overrated, seriously out of all the guys in the league, he is the most overrated....i just can't see it......................that was alittle cleaner, and there was no racism in it,

I was only comparing the first four years of each of their careers and then only in relative comparison to the other QBs in the league at the time. I think that is eminently fair. As I said in my other post, he gets another year or two. At the same time, I've never seen a team drop so much cash almost entirely based on potential.

[wrnboysfan]

lavar i think is the most overrated player in the NFL, although he is considered so overrated you could say he is underrated.

as for springs, i agree he is underrated.

what about the cowboys?

i think the assesment of roy was accurate because roy played out of position (FS) last year. this year he will be back on the line wrecking havoc.

i also think campbell is underrated. he is one of the best blocking TEs in the league. he will help the boys out a lot in the running game.

[skinsguy]

Who cares? The Cowboys stink...