Answer the question LA

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by Longtimefan

Heaping praise on one player for physically ending the carreer of another (even if he's a Cowboy) is not in my mind a fond revelation. We should all hate to see any player get hurt at any time for any team. Everytime I hear someone speak of the LaVar on Aikman hit with fondness, I'm reminded of Jack Tatum and the hit he put on Darryl Stingley that cripled him for life. I was hoping at that time I would never again see anything like it, and can never imagine hearing of it as if it's something good.

I think you're basically correct. Everybody loves a good hit, but ideally the "victim" gets up soon after, if not immediately after. Unfortunately, the Redskins have not had the best of luck against the Cowboys these past few years. As a result, we have to take joy in the small things such as LaVar's hit. Had we won more games versus Dallas recently I'm not sure we would look back on that one hit with such fondness

[CRT3]

Originally Posted by Daseal

I mean, Trotter really did out-play Pierce last year.

Your kidding I hope. If you look at the way teams attacked the Eagles last year you would see that they ran the ball up the middle. This was there weak point for their defense. Trotter had a ton of tackles cause they were running right at him. This guy was sent in on a run blitz or a pass blitz almost every play. Could he cover a tight end or a RB. Pierce played the run and pass well and in a system that aggreed to his playing ability. Trotter an All-Pro was joke.

[MTK]

Pierce is a more well rounded player than Trotter.

Trotter is very one dimensional as we should all know by now.

[PSUSkinsFan21]

Originally Posted by Daseal

When he buys into a scheme I'll buy into him as a player. He doesn't give a fuck about the team, he cares about LaVar and LaVar only. Until he proves otherwise that's what I'm going on. Let's use the pro-bowl as an example of playing prowess? I guess Springs, Griffen, Pierce, etc didn't deserve to be there. I mean, Trotter really did out-play Pierce last year.

I live for the day that anyone offers some support for statements like this. Why things like this are repeatedly said about Lavar and no other player on our team is simply beyond me.
"Lavar doesn't give a fuck about the team, he cares about LaVar and LaVar only"? Really? So I guess every other player on our team is playing for free? What is it that the other players do that makes them "care" so much more about the team? Do they sign long extensions to contracts without testing free agency because they want to be lifelong skins? Oops, I'm sorry, that's what LaVar did.

And how exactly is it that you KNOW Lavar hasn't bought into Williams's system? He was hurt all last year, yet you presume to know that he wouldn't have bought into Williams' system? And prior to that, what EXACTLY was the "scheme" Lavar didn't buy into? Which one of the four different schemes didn't he buy into? And which of our other players did? That is, if you can even name one guy on our defense that has seen as many different Redskins coaches as Lavar has had to play under. You talk about this grand "scheme"? News flash: our defense wasn't really anything to write home about prior to Williams. I'm not so sure we even had a real defensive "scheme" that anyone could define or describe prior to Williams.

And I find it hysterical that you even bring up Springs, Griffin and Pierce. Not a single one of these guys ever started for the skins before Greg Williams came to town. None of them were repeated pro-bowl caliber players before playing under Williams. Yet Lavar went to the pro bowl having to play for illdefined and constantly changing defensive "schemes" three times. I would argue that his accomplishments on a sub-par, misguided defense are far more impressive than guys who played great for a great coach who truly had his act together and finally ran a tight ship. You blame the Redskins organization for so many other things......but THIS, is all Lavar's fault? Makes sense to me.

[PSUSkinsFan21]

To clarify my last post, the only thing that really got me pissed off was saying that Lavar doesn't give a fuck about the team, and he only cares about himself. If you want to talk football, let's talk football. But I don't understand the need to attack a man's character like that.

But of course, that's just what certain of you do. You make presumptions about Lavar that you can't back up to save your life. You presume that if some guys missed voluntary team activities, one of them must have been Lavar (even though you're dead wrong about it). At every turn you presume the worst with him, yet give guys like Kellen Winslow, Sean Taylor and Maurice Clarett the benefit of the doubt. I mean, if Lavar raped you sister or something, then I could understand it......but it's just so inconsistent to be as hard on Lavar as some of you are without taking the same hard-line stance against other NFL players. It just doesn't make any sense to me.

[MTK]

Ouch, PSU coming out swingin'

LOL

LaVar is that you?

[JWsleep]

RIght on, PSU!!! I'm with you, man! Score one for Happy Valley!!!

[Daseal]

Your kidding I hope.

Yes, CRT3. It was just sarcasm trying to prove that a Pro Bowl appearence normally means squat.

And how exactly is it that you KNOW Lavar hasn't bought into Williams's system?

How do you know he has? I simply said that until he proves it I won't buy that he believes. Sorry if that's too hard to fathom that I won't close my eyes and jump praying that LaVar is there to catch me not on the other side of the field freelancing.

And I find it hysterical that you even bring up Springs, Griffin and Pierce.

Gee, Not like Sean Springs has been to the Pro Bowl before. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/misc/pb1998.htm
Anyhow, I think you completely missed the fact of that statement. Those players were some of the best at their position last year yet didn't get to the Pro Bowl. Why not?

We didn't have a scheme before Greg Williams? Yeah, that Marvin Lewis. Shame he doesnt have any credentials. Oh, arguably one of the top 3 defenses of all time... Wow. Yeah, you're right. He hasn't had a scheme to buy into! Good thing he didn't listen to that guy and try the 3 point stance.

hat is it that the other players do that makes them "care" so much more about the team? Do they sign long extensions to contracts without testing free agency because they want to be lifelong skins?

Ask them if they want to be the highest paid player for their position, then see what their answer is. Oh, by the way. I bet they wouldn't bitch about roster bonuses that are impossible to the cap to give.

LaVar is an exciting and physically gifted player, but I want to see him play with the team not against it. Granted, he hasn't had much of a chance in Williams scheme and people can always change. I hope he does. I feel the contract was too large for the on-field production. I haven't seen the leadership aspect out of him I had once hoped for and I'm not sure if it's coming. He'll make lots of big plays, but people like to ignore the big plays he gives up because he's out of position.

[BrudLee]

Out with the bad air...

In with the good air...

Relax, everyone. Daseal's point that Lavar's freewheeling style may not mesh with Williams's controlled pressure schemes is valid, if inartfully expressed. It shouldn't be taken as an indictment of Lavar's immense talent.

As for Lavar's working within a scheme, I think the point being made is that he's been forced to be in a different scheme each year, not that those scheme weren't any good.

We should, perhaps, all relax, before a moderator locks down this topic due to a flame war starting for no good reason.

[PSUSkinsFan21]

Originally Posted by Daseal

How do you know he has? I simply said that until he proves it I won't buy that he believes. Sorry if that's too hard to fathom that I won't close my eyes and jump praying that LaVar is there to catch me not on the other side of the field freelancing.

I don't have to know that he has......I'm not the one criticizing him for not "giving a fuck about the team". When I criticize a player, I back it with some facts. And I also don't presume things about players as you presume that he's refused to accept Williams's system.

Gee, Not like Sean Springs has been to the Pro Bowl before. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/misc/pb1998.htm

Wow, once......in 1998........yep, you got me there. Clearly he came to the skins in 2004 still in pro bowl form.

Anyhow, I think you completely missed the fact of that statement. Those players were some of the best at their position last year yet didn't get to the Pro Bowl. Why not?

I don't know why not. I think they should have been there too.......but does that necessarily mean that the other CBs, LBs (except for Trotter......I agree with you on that one), and DTs that did make the pro bowl didn't deserve it?

We didn't have a scheme before Greg Williams? Yeah, that Marvin Lewis. Shame he doesnt have any credentials. Oh, arguably one of the top 3 defenses of all time... Wow. Yeah, you're right. He hasn't had a scheme to buy into! Good thing he didn't listen to that guy and try the 3 point stance.

First of all, how many years ago was that? Second of all, how many years did Lavar get to play under Marvin Lewis? You're still holding a grudge against a player for being young and stubborn how many years later? You know what's funny, I can't think of a single coach that's complained about Lavar the way you do. Think there's something to that?

Ask them if they want to be the highest paid player for their position, then see what their answer is.

Huh? You presume they don't want to be the highest paid player for their position?

I feel the contract was too large for the on-field production.

Then take that up with the front office. Go call Danny Boy and tell him what you think. But holding that against Lavar is just crazy. He didn't get that contract by holding out or demanding a trade. He got it because he played great and the REDSKINS decided they wanted to lock this guy up right away and make him a career skin. Give me one good reason you hold his contract against him? Last I heard he didn't hold a gun to anyone's head to get what he felt he deserved (oops, that's right.......that's another member of our team that does that, who you feel is more worthy of praise).

And before you even think about bringing up the contract dispute, tell me one single day that he didn't show up for work or give 100% on the field all the while that dispute was outstanding. Again, in a day in age when players routinely cast aside the good of the team and hold out and pout to get what they want, I think it's ridiculous to say that a guy like Lavar only cares about himself. You couldn't be more wrong about this point, in my humble opinion.

I haven't seen the leadership aspect out of him I had once hoped for and I'm not sure if it's coming.

Really, then tell me who it was that got in the faces of other members of our esteemed defense a few years back for not taking losses seriously and not giving 100% on the bus ride home?

[PSUSkinsFan21]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

RIght on, PSU!!! I'm with you, man! Score one for Happy Valley!!!

Thanks JW.

I just don't understand this extreme hatred for Lavar. There are so many players in the NFL (and arguably one on our team) that deserve such animosity more than Lavar.......why not direct some of that hatred that way? I swear it's like it's personal.