Whose QB Should We Choose?

[warriorzpath]

Originally Posted by SOUL-SKINS

J. Jones in first. Kyles man Dalton in the second. Let's give Kyle some toys.

I wouldn't mind this as much as some others would, but how much of a gamble would that be -- knowing how much some teams need qbs -- to rely that Dalton would still be available when the skins pick in the 2nd round?

[Dirtbag59]

Originally Posted by SOUL-SKINS

J. Jones in first. Kyles man Dalton in the second. Let's give Kyle some toys.

Dalton will not last that long. Right now he's looking at being as high as the 24th pick (it's rumored that some teams are scared the Seahawks might take him so the 24th pick is being targeted for teams looking to trade up). And if he does make it to the second round I believe he'll be a top 5 pick...in the second round.

His pre draft stock is a good bit better then a similar prospect in Kolb who went 36th overall.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

So, the general word is that the two QBs at the top of the Redskins board are Andy Dalton and Jake Locker..

How viable that is, who knows for sure. But let's assume that's true for the purposes of this discussion.

So Kyle Shanahan is an Andy Dalton guy, and Mike Shanahan is a Jake Locker guy.

Question here is who should get to pick his QB?

On the one hand-Mike Shanahan is the President and Head Coach of the team. Ultimately he's accountable for everything. On the other hand, we're running Kyle Shanahan's offense, he's the one calling the plays, and he's likely a longer term fixture on the Redskins sideline (unless he bolts for someplace else) than his dad.

This isn't about which QB you think we should draft, just whose choice do you think it should be?

Going along with your premise...

This is a great question, but imo its a question that leads to other questions to answer adequately.

The HC should choose the QB especially when the HC is Mike Shanahan.

The bottom line for me is that the HC always has final say on personnel decisions.

A second and at least equal voice when it comes specifically to the QB position needs to be the OC.
The OC is ultimately the person in charge of the offense and the person that's gonna work the closet with the QB so its imperative that the OC be on board w/ the decision.

Then you have to consider the experience/respective track records with QBs and eye for talent at the QB position.

Imo there should be no question about who is the superior talent in this regard.

I believe that Mike S. could have coached the exact same personnel we had on offense last year and the results would have been better. And I believe that Mike can guide Kyle through the process of becoming not only a top OC but a potential HC candidate. But I digress.




















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I'm not sure if I agree with all your premises. (mainly about how long and how big a factor the respective coaches tenures are to the decision making process)

I'm not privvy to the same information you are but I doubt the situation is as simple as Kyle likes QB X and Mike likes QB Y.

I think the dichomoty of the thought process behind who likes which QB must be much deeper then that.
But, back to the decision making process.

At the end of the day QB evaluation is pretty much universal, meaning that
if Kyle and Mike are grading out the QBs there rankings will be close.

One may like QB X a little more then QB Y but it wouldn't mean they dislike the other QB prospect.

The question for me boils down to value rather then who like which QB more.

Imo the difference and benefit between the way Kyle runs the offense vs Mike is that Mike's requires or excells under the direction of a QB w/ elite physical talent (i.e. velocity/mobility) where Kyle's offense does not require elite arm talent or mobility.

In most cases a good QB albeit less physically gifted can be found outside the 1st 2 rounds; which is a good thing because it reduces the resources that need to spent on the QB position.

But in this draft it appears that the cost for all QBs has been inflated by the demand to the point where the cost for a physically gifted QB may only be marginally more expensive then the cost of a QB w/ average physical skills.

If Locker and Dalton are closely rated by the passing game staff then the question comes down to how much they like to gamble:
the certainty of a Locker a scheme diverse but raw QB with elite physical gifts QB they like at 10 vs an extra pick+ the highly likely possibility of scheme specific, more polished but less physically gifted QB the like in a trade down scenario (Dalton/Ponder) but a significantly reduced likelihood of Locker and also the possibility a wildcard QB like Mallett a more elite arm talent, polished QB that's more scheme diverse then the Dalton/Ponder.

My question is if they Dalton and maybe Ponder shouldn't they also like Ricky Stanzi?

[skinsfaninok]

I don't know if it matters unless we get some talent around the QB, at any rate is take Kyles QB over Mikes but draft Locker if that makes since.. I think Jake could be a Drop back passer in time.

[30gut]

Does John Beck have a 'guy'?

[backrow]

Originally Posted by rypper11

Of course I'd rather have Rex this year, draft defense exclusively this year and get a qb next year.

AMEN Bro. Rypper! AMEN! Defense wins championships, and Lord knows we don't have much to talk about on Defense! I wish there was a poll choice to abstain from QBs in this Draft, or trade back to get one later in the 2nd, or 3rd if we are able.

It's a real shame that the two sides can't get together and iron out this labor deal. Then we might get the rumored trade of #5 to the Vikes, and re-coup some of what we gave up to get him.

[SOUL-SKINS]

Originally Posted by Dirtbag59

Dalton will not last that long. Right now he's looking at being as high as the 24th pick (it's rumored that some teams are scared the Seahawks might take him so the 24th pick is being targeted for teams looking to trade up). And if he does make it to the second round I believe he'll be a top 5 pick...in the second round.

His pre draft stock is a good bit better then a similar prospect in Kolb who went 36th overall.

Dirtbag you always ruin everything!!! Why! Well then if Kyle really sees something in Dalton trade up in the first to get him. I know it's risky but I'm crushing hard on jones at 10. No qb to me is worthy of a top 10 pick other then Gabbert..... SS ...have you heard any rumors of Mallet being linked to the skins at all ?? Like you SS im warming up to him. This is how threads vare off track I know......I always do this.

[SmootSmack]

Nothing really legit, that I know of, is linking the Redskins to Mallet. And, I haven't warmed up to him to the point I'd want to draft him

[SmootSmack]

Originally Posted by 30gut

Going along with your premise...

This is a great question, but imo its a question that leads to other questions to answer adequately.

The HC should choose the QB especially when the HC is Mike Shanahan.

The bottom line for me is that the HC always has final say on personnel decisions.

A second and at least equal voice when it comes specifically to the QB position needs to be the OC.
The OC is ultimately the person in charge of the offense and the person that's gonna work the closet with the QB so its imperative that the OC be on board w/ the decision.

Then you have to consider the experience/respective track records with QBs and eye for talent at the QB position.

Imo there should be no question about who is the superior talent in this regard.

I believe that Mike S. could have coached the exact same personnel we had on offense last year and the results would have been better. And I believe that Mike can guide Kyle through the process of becoming not only a top OC but a potential HC candidate. But I digress.




















--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm not sure if I agree with all your premises. (mainly about how long and how big a factor the respective coaches tenures are to the decision making process)

I'm not privvy to the same information you are but I doubt the situation is as simple as Kyle likes QB X and Mike likes QB Y.

I think the dichomoty of the thought process behind who likes which QB must be much deeper then that.
But, back to the decision making process.

At the end of the day QB evaluation is pretty much universal, meaning that
if Kyle and Mike are grading out the QBs there rankings will be close.

One may like QB X a little more then QB Y but it wouldn't mean they dislike the other QB prospect.

The question for me boils down to value rather then who like which QB more.

Imo the difference and benefit between the way Kyle runs the offense vs Mike is that Mike's requires or excells under the direction of a QB w/ elite physical talent (i.e. velocity/mobility) where Kyle's offense does not require elite arm talent or mobility.

In most cases a good QB albeit less physically gifted can be found outside the 1st 2 rounds; which is a good thing because it reduces the resources that need to spent on the QB position.

But in this draft it appears that the cost for all QBs has been inflated by the demand to the point where the cost for a physically gifted QB may only be marginally more expensive then the cost of a QB w/ average physical skills.

If Locker and Dalton are closely rated by the passing game staff then the question comes down to how much they like to gamble:
the certainty of a Locker a scheme diverse but raw QB with elite physical gifts QB they like at 10 vs an extra pick+ the highly likely possibility of scheme specific, more polished but less physically gifted QB the like in a trade down scenario (Dalton/Ponder) but a significantly reduced likelihood of Locker and also the possibility a wildcard QB like Mallett a more elite arm talent, polished QB that's more scheme diverse then the Dalton/Ponder.

My question is if they Dalton and maybe Ponder shouldn't they also like Ricky Stanzi?

With that huge gap in your post, I hadn't even realized you wrote more.

It's certainly not as simple as one guy likes player X, and another likes player Y. But, for the purposes of this thread I made it such.

Who the QBs are that are being discussed really doesn't matter. I could have said Kyle Shanahan wants Drew Carey to be QB, and Mike wants Drew Brees. I would think most of us would say Drew Brees would be the better option. The question is who should be the one to pick which QB he wants?

[skinsfaninok]

What happens if Vince Young is our QB?

[SOUL-SKINS]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

What happens if Vince Young is our QB?

Then we all die......

[SOUL-SKINS]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

What happens if Vince Young is our QB?

What do u mean what happens ???

[skinsfaninok]

^ I mean as far as which type of QB would we draft? Kyle type or mike?

[SOUL-SKINS]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

^ I mean as far as which type of QB would we draft? Kyle type or mike?

It has to be Kyles type qb. It's his offense......but it seemed that daddy had alot of say in plays called and personal. More then usual anyway. I think it hurts Kyle as a coach having his dad as the head coach. I think Mike is too involved in the offense if u ask me. I know he's the head man but he should back off alittle.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by skinsfaninok

^ I mean as far as which type of QB would we draft? Kyle type or mike?

It won't matter. V Young will not be our QB before the draft.