3 things from a very optimisitc fan.

[SkinsFan3000]

champ was obviously hurt yesterday. so was portis for that matter. he took a shot to the head. can i add another optimistic point and say what a fantastic hit by sean taylor on amani toomer??? anyone else see that? over the middle on the end zone line, taylor just pummeled him. i need to get tivo :frusty:

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

Did you know who Salavea was prior to last year? I didn't. And Noble was playing hurt, recovering from the knee. All I'm saying is there's hope that these coaches can find the players to make it work. Griffen is a tougher loss to replace. Let's hope he can make it back soon.

I think CP has looked good this year--I don't count yesterday because he only had 4 carries. That's not the problem here--Clinton can do what this team needs. It's all about the O-line. I'm kinda tired of re-hashing that trade. It's done. But I'm not sure why anything that happened on Sunday should have changed your opinion of Clinton. Maybe you already didn't like the trade. Fine. But I can't see laying yesterday's debacle on Portis. The whole team stunk from top to bottom. Pick your favorite player and see how they did.

Actually, I had heard of Joe Salavea prior to his stint here in Washington. Like I said, he along with Griffin and Noble made the stout run-stuffing unit what it was last year. While Noble was returning from a devastating knee injury, he wasn't playing hurt last year.

The problem is that the coaches won't be able to "find" the players to make this work. What they've got on the roster now is all there is. My point is not to expect the same type of performance out of Ryan Boschetti, Cedric Killings and Aki Jones. Those guys are fine just to rotate in to give the starters a breather -- but make no mistake, they are not starters. That was proven when the Giants racked up over 260 yards against us running the ball. To an extent, Williams brought out a whole lot more than anyone expected from the defense last season. But to be honest, the blitzes, the tackling, the convergence to the ball carrier hasn't been all that great this year, and Gregg Williams can't escape blame for that.

You're right about the Portis trade. Until somebody invents time machines, you can't bitch about the past. And you're also right about Portis being "good" this year. But that's just it, he's been ... good. He's not a superstar, and I'll bet you can ask just about any fan, and many within the organization (off the record, mind you) that Portis hasn't been quite the back he was in Denver. Not even close if you ask me. And by pointing that out, I don't pin all the blame for yesterday's loss on him solely. Someone mentioned that Portis just hasn't proven why he was worth all that we gave up to get him. I agree.

Let there be no doubt this was a team loss and no one, NOT ONE PLAYER on this team escapes criticism. My posts would go even longer than they already are if I were to attempt to single out all 53 players and how they shared in the stink they let out at Giants Stadium. By far, this loss looked worse than any of the 10 they dropped all of last year.

[JWsleep]

While I worry you may be right, Beems, I still think back to our debates prior to last year--we thought that the line defense against the run would be a weak spot, and that turned out not to be the case. So I think these coaches can make do with less than all-star talent there.

As for the stats against the run, what is worrisome is the big play, not the average against. Take out Barbers big runs and the D's average is not bad, even in a game where they ran way more plays than we did. But the big play is killing us. I'm not sure that that's the D-line getting hurt there as much as trouble with the second level--LBs over pursuing, DBs taking bad angles, etc. We need our D linemen to clog things up so our LBs can make plays against the run. I think we have guys that can do that. BUt if the scheme is giving up the big play a few times a game, we are in trouble.

BTW, I didn't think any player escaped YOUR criticism! That was a general comment for those who select a few choice guys to blame, while missing the team's overall failure.

Still, I think we can fix this. We are not as bad as we looked on Sunday. I do believe that Gibbs can find ways to motivate his players and get some positive out of this debacle. We'll see!

[Beemnseven]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

Still, I think we can fix this. We are not as bad as we looked on Sunday. I do believe that Gibbs can find ways to motivate his players and get some positive out of this debacle. We'll see!

Yep, might as well get it out of their system, never to return. Every team will have a game where nothing goes right. Happens to the best of them every year -- even the '85 Bears. You'd just rather it happen against an non-conference opponent, not your division rivals!

[56FAN]

Don't get me started on the bailey for portis trade. they should have traded him for draft picks.we are a power running team , always have been. and to also give a second rounder on top of that wasn't right

[heybigstar]

Yeah, I dont think portis is a top 4 RB in this league

[jrocx69]

Originally Posted by heybigstar

These questions/comments come from me not to put down our beloved team, but to raise some issues that i think are relevant for our franchise.


1. If we lose to the Eagles this week, our playoff hopes become less than 10% (virtually impossible).

At 4-4 and last place in our division coupled with a tough schedule coming up, it would be very tough to make a run at 10-6. If we win and we make it to 5-3, it would still be tough, however TB at TB looks winnable now.


2. Even though he has been injured this year, Is Clinton Portis overrated?

I like him a lot, I do. But he makes more than any RB in the league. Plus, Denver has proven to plug in multiple 1000 yd runners. He is a good RB, no doubt. But is he as explosive as he has been hyped up to be?


3. Will our team be able to fight off injuries and still be effective?

All teams get injuries. That is not the problem. But teams like the patriots and the eagles can play playoff caliber football even when they lose 5-6 starters from their team. I feel that if we lose even one offensive lineman, our O-line play drops off considerably. I think we need more depth there. Also, I think losing Cooley is big, because i think Robert Royal is not a good H-back.

On defense, injuries to the D-line seem like they can be adjusted to. But not having Griffin really hurts.

Sellers and Koz are our back up HB's

[Southpaw]

One thing...Portis is the 2nd highest paid back in the league...Tomlinson is the highest.

[backrow]

It hasn't been mentioned much, but we went for the TD, when we could have settled for a FG.

I admire HOF Coach Gibbs for that!

[MTK]

Originally Posted by JWsleep

I'm kinda tired of re-hashing that trade. It's done. But I'm not sure why anything that happened on Sunday should have changed your opinion of Clinton. Maybe you already didn't like the trade. Fine. But I can't see laying yesterday's debacle on Portis. The whole team stunk from top to bottom. Pick your favorite player and see how they did.

I'm tired of it too. Some people love to pile on it especially after a loss.

Get over it already, the deal is done and this is the hand we've been dealt.

Overall our aquisitions have been pretty solid since Gibbs came back, you can't address every single need each offseason and each pickup isn't going to be a homerun. But again, as Schneed10 has pointed out before, overall we've had more hits than misses.

[railcon56]

Originally Posted by Mattyk72

I'm tired of it too. Some people love to pile on it especially after a loss.

Get over it already, the deal is done and this is the hand we've been dealt.

Overall our aquisitions have been pretty solid since Gibbs came back, you can't address every single need each offseason and each pickup isn't going to be a homerun. But again, as Schneed10 has pointed out before, overall we've had more hits than misses.

F_ck Champ!!!!!!!! he didnt wanna be here... and to be honest his ass was getting burnt alot in his last year here and
last sunday he looked pitiful...i