Sean Taylors play

[gabe1984]

I am not willing to admit that Sean Taylor's play has regressed since his first season playing for the Redskins. If you look at the last 6 Superbowl winners, they have all had great safeties on the defense. Let's rewind. Colts - Bob Sander, Steelers- Troy Polomalu, Patriots X2 - Rodney Harrison, Bucs - John Lynch, and then Harrison again. However, IMO, not one of these guys are the best player on their defense. They are able to go out and make plays beceause they all had a front 7 who could take care of business, unlike the Skins had last year. If you look at the 2005 season when our front 7 was good, Taylor was making plays all over the place!!!! No one cany deny that. Do you think Ed Reed would be as good as he is, and I'm not trying to take away from Reed because he's probably going to go down as one of the best saeties ever to play. But, do you think he would be as good as he is without playing with the likes of Ray Lewis, Chris McAllister, Adalius Thomas, or Terrell Suggs. I doubt it.

I feel like safety is a tough position to be making a lot of game changing plays at, like ST did in 2005, when the guys in front of you suck. If you took any one of the safeties I just mentioned and put them in instead of Taylor last year, I doubt any of them could do much better, IMO.

Is it true that ST missed a lot of tackles last year, yes it is. However, if you look closely at a lot of those plays, Sean was running from the other side of the field trying to make a play on a guy that was not even his responsibility!! So, yeah he may of missed some tackles, but a lot of those most safties in the NFL wouldnt be able to even come close to putting themselves in a position to make the play in the first place. ST is a freakin beast, and he's going to haunt your dreams for talking bad about him. He can do that.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by gabe1984

I am not willing to admit that Sean Taylor's play has regressed since his first season playing for the Redskins. If you look at the last 6 Superbowl winners, they have all had great safeties on the defense. Let's rewind. Colts - Bob Sander, Steelers- Troy Polomalu, Patriots X2 - Rodney Harrison, Bucs - John Lynch, and then Harrison again. However, IMO, not one of these guys are the best player on their defense. They are able to go out and make plays beceause they all had a front 7 who could take care of business, unlike the Skins had last year. If you look at the 2005 season when our front 7 was good, Taylor was making plays all over the place!!!! No one cany deny that. Do you think Ed Reed would be as good as he is, and I'm not trying to take away from Reed because he's probably going to go down as one of the best saeties ever to play. But, do you think he would be as good as he is without playing with the likes of Ray Lewis, Chris McAllister, Adalius Thomas, or Terrell Suggs. I doubt it.

I feel like safety is a tough position to be making a lot of game changing plays at, like ST did in 2005, when the guys in front of you suck. If you took any one of the safeties I just mentioned and put them in instead of Taylor last year, I doubt any of them could do much better, IMO.

Is it true that ST missed a lot of tackles last year, yes it is. However, if you look closely at a lot of those plays, Sean was running from the other side of the field trying to make a play on a guy that was not even his responsibility!! So, yeah he may of missed some tackles, but a lot of those most safties in the NFL wouldnt be able to even come close to putting themselves in a position to make the play in the first place. ST is a freakin beast, and he's going to haunt your dreams for talking bad about him. He can do that.

I think it's also worth pointing out that Sean led the Skins in tackles last year, and was in fact, one of the leading tacklers in all of the NFL last year.

Within NFL circles, I think it's safe to say many consider #21 one of the top safety's playing today.

That being said, I think if his number of tackles drop by 10 or so this year, it's possible his production will improve as a result.

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

I think it's also worth pointing out that Sean led the Skins in tackles last year, and was in fact, one of the leading tacklers in all of the NFL last year.

Within NFL circles, I think it's safe to say many consider #21 one of the top safety's playing today.

That being said, I think if his number of tackles drop by 10 or so this year, it's possible his production will improve as a result.

Please explain what you mean by production improving with less tackles. What?

[gabe1984]

Originally Posted by angryssg

Please explain what you mean by production improving with less tackles. What?

I think he means he won't get the chance to make as many tackles because hopefully our LBs and DL can stop the running backs before they even get to the secondary. This will give ST more of an opportunity to roam around the field and snag passes as well as pulverize a poor little TO or Tony Romo. So while me may not have as many tackles, he has more of an opportunity to make ints, sacks, or plays for losses in the backfield.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by angryssg

Please explain what you mean by production improving with less tackles. What?

Simply put, doing less on his part means he'll probably end up being more productive, being in postion more often than not. He was a run support demon last year. That can be directly attributed to the 'bites' and mis-reads and bad angles he got burned on last year.

I think he got caught looking in the back field too much last year and relied on athleticism to make for it. But this is the NFL, no amount of athleticism can make up for a five or ten yard jump, I don't care who you are.

Another thing, look at Ed Reed's stats from last year, or any comparable saftey at the same position, and you'll probably see they had significantly less tackles than Sean Taylor.

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Simply put, doing less on his part means he'll probably end up being more productive, being in postion more often than not. He was a run support demon last year. That can be directly attributed to the 'bites' and mis-reads and bad angles he got burned on last year.

I think he got caught looking in the back field too much last year, and relied on athleticism to make for it. But this is the NFL, no amount of athleticism can make up for a five or ten yard jump, I don't care who you are.

Another thing, look at Ed Reed's stats from last year, or any comparable saftey at the same position, and you'll probably see they had significantly less tackles than Sean Taylor.

I understand completely what you are saying. But consider this, production is production whether he gets it in tackles or INT's, it is still production. So I believe that a more appropriate way to explain what you are saying is shift his focus to be more productive against the pass and worry less about the run. Correct.

[12thMan]

Originally Posted by angryssg

I understand completely what you are saying. But consider this, production is production whether he gets it in tackles or INT's, it is still production. So I believe that a more appropriate way to explain what you are saying is shift his focus to be more productive against the pass and worry less about the run. Correct.

Sure, that's another way to put it....I guess

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by 12thMan

Sure, that's another way to put it....I guess

You're welcome.

[Southpaw]

Using the word "regressed" is completely inaccurate when describing Taylors season last year. Regression is usually based on a trend, and Taylor had one down season, as did the entire defense. That is not a trend. It's a down season.

And describing his play for last season as poor is a matter of perspective. He blew a few coverages, but he had 35 more tackles last season, than the average of his first two seasons, so it's just as easy to say the front seven blew quite a few assignments as well. He obviously had to compensate for the lack of production around him, which directly affected his own production.

With the way the defense performed as a unit last season, it's ignorant to say that Taylor individually cost Washington any games.

[BrunellMVP?]

Originally Posted by GMScud

Face it folks, he's a baaaaaad man and a freak athlete.


YouTube - Sean Taylor From College To Da PROS

Didn't we used to make the same arguements for another highly capable, pro-bowling, fan favorite and overall specimen named LaVar? don't get me wrong, i loved LaVar, but he was grossly overrated. In my eyes, so is ST. He COULD be great, but has yet to live up to expectations (more so last year, where he was not good at all).

[BrunellMVP?]

Originally Posted by BrunellMVP?

Didn't we used to make the same arguements for another highly capable, pro-bowling, fan favorite and overall specimen named LaVar? don't get me wrong, i loved LaVar, but he was grossly overrated. In my eyes, so is ST. He COULD be great, but has yet to live up to expectations (more so last year, where he was not good at all).

And i'm aware that injuries led to Arrington's demise, but i'd argue he was given WAY too much credit and made pro-bowls based on popularity. Note- i stuff ballots too...

[KLHJ2]

Originally Posted by BrunellMVP?

Didn't we used to make the same arguements for another highly capable, pro-bowling, fan favorite and overall specimen named LaVar? don't get me wrong, i loved LaVar, but he was grossly overrated. In my eyes, so is ST. He COULD be great, but has yet to live up to expectations (more so last year, where he was not good at all).

So I guess that he got voted to the Pro Bowl by his peers based on his college performance huh? I don't care if he was an Alternate, he still went which means that he received more votes than at least 12 of his peers in the same confrence. Overrated my ass. He was doing something right.

[BrunellMVP?]

Originally Posted by angryssg

So I guess that he got voted to the Pro Bowl by his peers based on his college performance huh? I don't care if he was an Alternate, he still went which means that he received more votes than at least 12 of his peers in the same confrence. Overrated my ass. He was doing something right.

Pro-bowls have little use in determining akill...its a popularity contest.

[Schneed10]

Using tackles to measure the impact of a safety is a very bad metric. Having your safeties make a ton of tackles is the last thing you want; you want the ball carrier tackled before he reaches that level of the defense.

The fact that Taylor had 129 tackles speaks more to the ineptitude of our front 7 than it does to Taylor's "production".

INTs are a decent measure, but even those are driven by the opportunities to make INTs. For many years, Champ Bailey had only 2 or 3 INTs per season because nobody threw at him. QBs went after Archuleta a lot more than they tested Taylor. Plus, a defensive line that gets to the QB can often force an ill-advised pass, increasing the opportunities for your safeties to intercept the ball. If you have a worthless pass rush, you can't expect that many INT opportunities.

Defensive player performance can't be easily measured by statistics. You really just have to watch the guys play. I saw Taylor taking bad angles at times last season. I also saw him having to cover for Archuleta's inept play, which Taylor deserves credit for. I saw Taylor make a handful of impact plays, ripping fumbles loose, a couple INTs, and several huge tackles (the Carolina game). And I also saw him fail to get on the same page in terms of communication with the rest of the secondary (Taylor may not be to blame here, that could have been the coaching staff's fault for all we know). Overall he had a good season but has some room for improvement.

[12thMan]

To my point, the higher number of tackles, I feel, contributed to some of the lapses in coverage and so forth.

So when I speak of production, I consider that to be synonymous with "impact"...which sometimes can be measured by stats and sometimes it can't.