How far can Beck take us?

[GusFrerotte]

I am all for giving Beck a fair shake and I really hope he does make me eat crow, but common sense based on historical precedent, doesn't bode well for MR. Beck. I also think that Shanny and the FO know what they are doing. They know drafting a QB this season without shoring up the O line and upgrading the WR corp with tall, physical athletes would have been a waste. We need a massive upgrade in all positions. I think Beck is just there to backup Rex and possibly get the fans excited about something in what might be a .500 type record year. For the record, I think Shanny is a very good coach, but I don't think you can use the two SB titles as an example of how good he is since that team was built already before he was HC.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

I am all for giving Beck a fair shake and I really hope he does make me eat crow, but common sense based on historical precedent, doesn't bode well for MR. Beck. I also think that Shanny and the FO know what they are doing. They know drafting a QB this season without shoring up the O line and upgrading the WR corp with tall, physical athletes would have been a waste. We need a massive upgrade in all positions. I think Beck is just there to backup Rex and possibly get the fans excited about something in what might be a .500 type record year. For the record, I think Shanny is a very good coach, but I don't think you can use the two SB titles as an example of how good he is since that team was built already before he was HC.

I'm definitely not calling Shanny a coaching god, I'm simply saying he's an established coach with established credentials. He's nowhere near as bad a coach as Spurrier was. And using Beck as a way to drum up excitement for the team has to be the most asinine thing I've ever heard of. He's getting pounded on every message board, every tv station, and almost every website for his decision to go into the season with John Beck and Rex Grossman as his guys. He's staking his reputation on these guys. At least give him some benefit of the doubt. He has shown an ability to do things with lesser talent in the past.

[pg86]

Every NFL show every person out there is beating the hell out this kid verbally.

Mark Rypien is probably never going to the hall but he got the job done when everyone said he was garbage including Jack Kent Cooke to a point that he rolled up on Joe Gibbs and told him he screwed it up.

Im not saying he's the savior (for the record neither was campbell) I'm saying other than Joe Theisman (and I know im missing many generations of great skins players) this team's winning seasons weren't based on dynamite big name QB's hell one of them weren't even a starter in the league.

Give the Book of John (which is what alot of BYU fans refer to him as) a chance he didn't have much to win with in Miami so you can't solely fault him on that he was running for his life back there. Also Clemens, Chapell, and Grossman, all can win this job.

On a side note Did you catch Warren Sapps reaction when Joe Theisman said Beck looked alot like Brees!? Gotta say this is probably reaching but if we go 14-2 under this guy myself and a whole lotta skins fans are gonna be eating their hats and loads of crow too.

[SmootSmack]

I think, just gut instinct, Rex will be our day one starter. Maybe it's wishful thinking, but if it's Beck I'll be pulling for him as I imagine all Skins fans will

[That Guy]

Originally Posted by pg86

Every NFL show every person out there is beating the hell out this kid verbally.

Mark Rypien is probably never going to the hall but he got the job done when everyone said he was garbage including Jack Kent Cooke to a point that he rolled up on Joe Gibbs and told him he screwed it up.

Im not saying he's the savior (for the record neither was campbell) I'm saying other than Joe Theisman (and I know im missing many generations of great skins players) this team's winning seasons weren't based on dynamite big name QB's hell one of them weren't even a starter in the league.

Give the Book of John (which is what alot of BYU fans refer to him as) a chance he didn't have much to win with in Miami so you can't solely fault him on that he was running for his life back there. Also Clemens, Chapell, and Grossman, all can win this job.

On a side note Did you catch Warren Sapps reaction when Joe Theisman said Beck looked alot like Brees!? Gotta say this is probably reaching but if we go 14-2 under this guy myself and a whole lotta skins fans are gonna be eating their hats and loads of crow too.

we're not going 14-2... 8-8 would be pretty lucky.

[NLC1054]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

I am all for giving Beck a fair shake and I really hope he does make me eat crow, but common sense based on historical precedent, doesn't bode well for MR. Beck. I also think that Shanny and the FO know what they are doing. They know drafting a QB this season without shoring up the O line and upgrading the WR corp with tall, physical athletes would have been a waste. We need a massive upgrade in all positions. I think Beck is just there to backup Rex and possibly get the fans excited about something in what might be a .500 type record year. For the record, I think Shanny is a very good coach, but I don't think you can use the two SB titles as an example of how good he is since that team was built already before he was HC.

...Yeah, no it wasn't. The Broncos were in no way "built" before Shanahan was there. Shanahan was the one who put Rod Smith on the field. Shanahan drafted Terrell Davis. Mike Shanahan added McCafferty. Shanahan helped build the o-line with guys like Mark Schlereth, Shanahan bought in guys on the defensive guys on the ball.

The Broncos had been surviving on the talent of John Elway alone for years. There's a reason the Broncos got blown out in every single Super Bowl before Shanahan got there; they did a crappy job putting any sort of team around him. No run game, bad wide receivers.

Shanahan helped build a team around Elway that helped him win those two Super Bowls. The idea that Mike had little or nothing to do with those Denver Broncos teams winning is patently false and wrong headed.

[SFREDSKIN]

No one knows what Beck can do, rookie year doesn't count. I'm all for giving him a chance. He was great in college, is athletic, has a couple of years on the bench learning and just might surprise a lot of people. I would love to see him win the starting QB position.

[GusFrerotte]

Originally Posted by mooby

I'm definitely not calling Shanny a coaching god, I'm simply saying he's an established coach with established credentials. He's nowhere near as bad a coach as Spurrier was. And using Beck as a way to drum up excitement for the team has to be the most asinine thing I've ever heard of. He's getting pounded on every message board, every tv station, and almost every website for his decision to go into the season with John Beck and Rex Grossman as his guys. He's staking his reputation on these guys. At least give him some benefit of the doubt. He has shown an ability to do things with lesser talent in the past.

What do you mean? Everyone is talking about Beck, and whether he can do it or not!! That is drumming up interest!!!!!!!! Getting folks to talk, etc is still ginning up publicity. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys have stayed in the limelight using these type of tactics. If they didn't, nobody would give a rat's ass about them. Same with the Redskins. The new thing now among celebrities is to always stay in the headlines, even with negative publicity. You can't tell me the Cowboys haven't made $$$$$$$$$$$ off of their soap opera existence the last 15 years. And Snyder has Jones tactics down pat as well. How else can you be one of the richest sports franchises in the world and always putting out a crap product?

[GusFrerotte]

I mean look at the crap that happened during the last 4 years and tell me that controversy, crazy antics, and crazy ass decision making by the front office hasn't generated a ton of $$$$ for Snyder. JC, AH, and the McNabb sagas, gave Snyder free publicity in selling tickets. Shanahan has given the fans reason to hope for better days, just like the initial excitement of Spurrier's hiring, or when Coach Gibbs came back. Bringing in controversy or a breath of fresh air keeps the fans interested or at the very least talking, and that is bound to generate an increase in revenue. Bottom line is negative publicity is still publicity.

[mooby]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

What do you mean? Everyone is talking about Beck, and whether he can do it or not!! That is drumming up interest!!!!!!!! Getting folks to talk, etc is still ginning up publicity. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys have stayed in the limelight using these type of tactics. If they didn't, nobody would give a rat's ass about them. Same with the Redskins. The new thing now among celebrities is to always stay in the headlines, even with negative publicity. You can't tell me the Cowboys haven't made $$$$$$$$$$$ off of their soap opera existence the last 15 years. And Snyder has Jones tactics down pat as well. How else can you be one of the richest sports franchises in the world and always putting out a crap product?

You might be right about negative publicity still being publicity and all that, but starting John Beck is not a publicity move. Look at it like this: Do you think Snyder wants to win, or make money? Granted, he wants to make both. But winning is at the top of his agenda, because there's no doubt if the Redskins were winning consistently, he'd make even more money than he's making now.

Shanny is staking his future on these two qb's. If he didn't think they were capable of being a starting quarterback, we would've traded for, signed, or drafted someone that could be.

Being a coach is not about publicity stunts. It's about winning games. To think that Shanny would rather care about publicity than winning football games is asinine, because if he doesn't win games he won't stick around. And the bottom line is that Shanny and Bruce Allen are running this team, not Dan Snyder. You think Dan Snyder would go out and give 27 mil to a defensive end with minimal starting experience? Please.

[gafinfan]

Originally Posted by skinster

True, but Kolb was kept on his team instead of one of the Eagles all time great qbs. Beck was a 2nd rounder who got cut by the team that drafted him 2 years later, then got cut as the third string qb by the ravens, then was our 3rd string qb last year. And to add insult to injury, Beck will be 30, which gives less longevity possibility. Neither has proven anything, but how they have been treated by their respective teams is a pretty large indicator of how much they are valued in the nfl and a reasonably accurate predictor of how they will do in the future. Of course, neither has proven anything yet so there are no absolutes, but if you can't see why Redskins fans are concerned, then I think that's on you.

Your team just traded an all pro QB from the same team you are singing praises of their treatment of their QB's as being an indicator of said QB's worth. One has to wonder why you would think so highly of that system to compare Kolb to Beck with Beck being the negative of the two.

I will bet here and now that Beck will out play Kolb this season. jm2c I will also bet that Kolb will be back in the barn at the Reed house for free within 3 years! The Cards were idiots for paying that much for Kolb and Reed must be dying laughing all the way to the bank this year! He pulled that on us with Feeley back in 03-04.

As for Orton I'm so happy Miami didn't do the stupid deal and pay an equal price for Orton. BTW the guy is 11 & 18 in his last 29 starts, so much for him being anyone's savior!

[Dirtbag59]

Should never have traded Jason Campbell

[saden1]

Originally Posted by GusFrerotte

What do you mean? Everyone is talking about Beck, and whether he can do it or not!! That is drumming up interest!!!!!!!! Getting folks to talk, etc is still ginning up publicity. Jerry Jones and the Cowboys have stayed in the limelight using these type of tactics. If they didn't, nobody would give a rat's ass about them. Same with the Redskins. The new thing now among celebrities is to always stay in the headlines, even with negative publicity. You can't tell me the Cowboys haven't made $$$$$$$$$$$ off of their soap opera existence the last 15 years. And Snyder has Jones tactics down pat as well. How else can you be one of the richest sports franchises in the world and always putting out a crap product?

The Paris Hilton of the NFL.

[30gut]

Originally Posted by mooby

You might be right about negative publicity still being publicity and all that, but starting John Beck is not a publicity move. Look at it like this: Do you think Snyder wants to win, or make money? Granted, he wants to make both. But winning is at the top of his agenda, because there's no doubt if the Redskins were winning consistently, he'd make even more money than he's making now.

Shanny is staking his future on these two qb's. If he didn't think they were capable of being a starting quarterback, we would've traded for, signed, or drafted someone that could be.

+1 I was thinking the same thing about Beck vs Kolb:

Originally Posted by me from another forum

Imo people/many fans have a hard time separating a QB's individual talent from the context of their surroundings.

How much of Kolb's success is due to the Eagles FO, scheme, coaching, and surrounding talent?

How much of Beck's 'failure' was due to Miami's FO, scheme, coaching and surrounding talent?

That's why a proper assessment of skillset is important.

I don't think their is a huge difference between the skillset of Kolb vs John Beck.

But, even in this forum the perception is that Beck is barely more physically talented then Rex Grossman.

I think its a safe bet that if Beck wins the starting job here he'll put up better numbers then Kolb.

[Dirtbag59]

I hope Beck and his wife end up annoying me as much as Kurt Warner and his wife after retirement. They already have a lot of similarities. Both deeply religious, throw ugly spirals deep, accurate, quick release, won't shut up about how confident they are, overlooked one way or another. Still can anyone give me a definitive report on how Beck looks in camp. All I have is Kyle Shanahan saying he needs to tell him to leave him alone, a couple of ugly deep balls, a million questions, and the work ethic of every great QB in this league.