One Positive...

Gmanc711 · 10-11-2004, 01:05 AM

I'll tell you what, I havent seen a defense like this since I have been a skins fan. Its agruably the best defense in the NFL right now, and I'm not exaturating. I can think of 3 drives in 5 games where we actually got driven on, for a TD. Its a damn shame we are wasting this defense. I just wanted to make sure they got some congrats, cause they played a great game tonight, and have played awsome all season.

sportscurmudgeon · 10-11-2004, 01:13 AM

Fourth quarter - Skins are down 4 points - Ravens are backed up inside their 10 yardline. A quick three and out and the Skins have a real shot to go ahead by getting good field position.

What did the "league's best defense" do? They got the ball jammed up their collective butts as the Ravens marched down the field for a field goal and consumed about 5 minutes off the clock. Great defenses don't let that happen. Everyone knew Jamal Lewis and Chester Taylor were going to carry the ball; so if everyone knew, how come the league's best defense didn't know? Or is it that they knew and couldn't stop it?

What happened on the next possession? Ravens run the ball for first downs and run out the clock.

The Skins led 10-0 at the half. In the second half the Ravens ran the ball about 25 times and threw it 3 times. They held the ball for most of the half. How is that the "league's best defense"?

Now on the other side of the field there was a defense which did not allow the Redskins offense to generate more than one first down in any drive and held them to 197 yards of total offense...

skinsguy · 10-11-2004, 01:16 AM

Yet the defense can't carry the offense forever. Yeah it was frustrating but face it..the d just got tired! If the O can score more than 10 - 17 points a game we wouldn't be discussing the defense.

wolfeskins · 10-11-2004, 01:20 AM

the d did stop the ravens near the end of the game.the skins o got the ball back with around 5 minutes left,they went 3 and out

rickmmrr · 10-11-2004, 01:26 AM

The defense did there job. The offense sucks.

MTK · 10-11-2004, 01:32 AM

The D has done their jobs all season. If we had any hint of an offense things would be much different.

Gmanc711 · 10-11-2004, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon

Fourth quarter - Skins are down 4 points - Ravens are backed up inside their 10 yardline. A quick three and out and the Skins have a real shot to go ahead by getting good field position.

What did the "league's best defense" do? They got the ball jammed up their collective butts as the Ravens marched down the field for a field goal and consumed about 5 minutes off the clock. Great defenses don't let that happen. Everyone knew Jamal Lewis and Chester Taylor were going to carry the ball; so if everyone knew, how come the league's best defense didn't know? Or is it that they knew and couldn't stop it?

What happened on the next possession? Ravens run the ball for first downs and run out the clock.

The Skins led 10-0 at the half. In the second half the Ravens ran the ball about 25 times and threw it 3 times. They held the ball for most of the half. How is that the "league's best defense"?

Now on the other side of the field there was a defense which did not allow the Redskins offense to generate more than one first down in any drive and held them to 197 yards of total offense...

PLEASE! First of all I said arguably the leagues best defense, and I still belive that. But common, what the else could you ask that defense to do tonight? Stop them in the 4th quarter so Brunell could throw a few more sh*tty balls and they could go out there again. I mean they gave up 3 points tonight. 3 POINTS!!! Our offense gave up 7, Our Specials gave up 7.
You said ... " The Skins led 10-0 at the half. In the second half the Ravens ran the ball about 25 times and threw it 3 times. They held the ball for most of the half. How is that the "league's best defense"? " ITS ARGUABLY THE LEAGUES BEST DEFENSE, BECAUSE THEY DIDNT GIVE UP ANY POINTS! I dont care about time of possession, I dont care about yardage, they gave up 3 points the entire freaking game. How can you not make an argument that its the best defense in the league. I'm not saying it is, I said arguably, and I stand by that statement. I cant ask for anymore out of these guys, and I dont know how anyone could.

MTK · 10-11-2004, 01:35 AM

You can't blame this one on the D tonight. Yeah they wore down in crunchtime but the offense hung them out to dry tonight.

The D was on the field way too long, and against a physcial team like the Ravens eventually they're going to break you.

redwagonskins · 10-11-2004, 02:32 AM

Even Joe says you have to score 21 poitns to have a chance at winning. I think our D would agree with that.

itvnetop · 10-11-2004, 04:22 AM

there's no way you can pin this on the D... how many three and outs did our offense have? the D is the only reason we scored tonight... it would have been 17-0 if it wasn't for them... probably worse.

offiss · 10-11-2004, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redwagonskins

Even Joe says you have to score 21 poitns to have a chance at winning. I think our D would agree with that.

I think our D would be happy if our offense gave up less point's than they do!

I have been a skin's fan since 72', and this is the best skin's D I have ever seen, period!

That Guy · 10-11-2004, 05:25 AM

jamal didn't get a TD did he?

i was right to bench him for emmitt smith btw... jamal is 11 points, while emmitt is 13 this week.

Luxorreb · 10-11-2004, 05:56 AM

D played a good game. Allowed 3 pts.
Played hard all season and without Barrow or for 3 weeks Arrington. For a noname DL also missing Daniels they've done a great job. This is the first week they've let a back go over 100 yds or even close to that all season. Sure they could play better at the end of the game, but what else do ya want? They had 3 INTS in the 1st half. Blame the offense for the loss if ya blame anyone. I'm not into scapegoats but if I was I'd blame Betts and Brunell. Sure as hell can't blame the refs for this one!

sportscurmudgeon · 10-11-2004, 10:39 AM

Let me correct soemthing I put in my previous post in this thread. The Redskins did indeed make more than one first down in one of their drives last night. They had one drive with two first downs; it was the drive that ended with Deion's interception. I overlooked that drive when I glanced at my game chart. My mistake; the Ravens defense did allow that to happen.

If you don't care about yardage and time of posession as a statistic to worry about over the course of an entire game or a season you are absolutely correct. When the Rams won the Super Bowl, they only led in time of posession in two or three games for the whole season. It can be a very misleading stat.

I am not blaming the defense for losing last night's game; you can hang the blame directly on the offensive line because they stunk like a skunk's butt. But this thread started with the Redskins' defense being called arguably the best in the league. Well, I argue that they are good but nowhere near the best in the league.

And time of possession in a critical part of last night's game is one reason they are not the best.

Here are my notes from my game chart - as best as I can read them because I never did well in penmanship:

Ravens 17 - Skins 10 4th quarter 10:16 to play. Baltimore ball.

1st and 10 at the Baltimore 8

Jamal Lewis runs three times for a first down at the Balt 20 (8:53 to play)

Lewis out; Chester Taylor runs twice for a first down at the Balt 31 (7:37 to play)

Jamal Lewis tackled for a 3 yard loss

Jamal Lewis gains one yard

Kyle Boller throws incomplete pass (time remaining 5:43)

On that posession the Ravens managed to consume almost 50% of the time remaining in the game. This is a point in the game where a field goal is of little or no value; the offense needs the ball in good field position with some time left to maneuver. The defense did not do that for them.

But amazingly, the Ravens gave the Skins good field position because of Hartwell's brain cramp that caused him to take off his helmet on the field. So the Ravens gave the Skins what the Skins' defense could not give them - really good field position. And then the offense went three and out with a net gain of zero yards. Balt gets the ball back with 4:50 to play. The offense held the ball for all of 46 seconds.

So the defense had another chance to force a turnover or force a three and out to give the offense one more shot - which would probably have been futile anyway given the way the game had been going. But iot was the only hope.

Didn't happen. If my counting is correct, the Ravens ran the ball 8 consecutive plays for 53 yards - that's 6.6 yards per carry for those keeping score at home. Then they knelt down and let the game expire.

Remember, I DID NOT say the defense lost that game; the offense lost it But I am saying that if you want to call this the best defense in the league you have to explain how they allowed the Ravens to hold the ball for 9 minutes and 30 seconds in the final 10 minutes and 16 seconds of the game. That is 93% of the time that the Baltimore offense held the ball during crunch time. If this is arguably the best defense in the league, would you also say that Baltimore has arguably the best offense in the league? I hope not. Remember, all the Skins needed was one score to tie it up.

Time of posession mattered a whole lot here and it would be worthwhile to worry about it a lot if this becomes a pattern...

MTK · 10-11-2004, 10:44 AM

I wonder how much better our D would look if the offense could sustain some time consuming drives to let them rest a bit.

10-11-2004, 01:05 AM	#1
Gmanc711 Thank You, Sean. Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Gaithersburg, MD Age: 39 Posts: 7,506	One Positive... I'll tell you what, I havent seen a defense like this since I have been a skins fan. Its agruably the best defense in the NFL right now, and I'm not exaturating. I can think of 3 drives in 5 games where we actually got driven on, for a TD. Its a damn shame we are wasting this defense. I just wanted to make sure they got some congrats, cause they played a great game tonight, and have played awsome all season. __________________ #21

10-11-2004, 01:13 AM	#2
sportscurmudgeon Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,159	Fourth quarter - Skins are down 4 points - Ravens are backed up inside their 10 yardline. A quick three and out and the Skins have a real shot to go ahead by getting good field position. What did the "league's best defense" do? They got the ball jammed up their collective butts as the Ravens marched down the field for a field goal and consumed about 5 minutes off the clock. Great defenses don't let that happen. Everyone knew Jamal Lewis and Chester Taylor were going to carry the ball; so if everyone knew, how come the league's best defense didn't know? Or is it that they knew and couldn't stop it? What happened on the next possession? Ravens run the ball for first downs and run out the clock. The Skins led 10-0 at the half. In the second half the Ravens ran the ball about 25 times and threw it 3 times. They held the ball for most of the half. How is that the "league's best defense"? Now on the other side of the field there was a defense which did not allow the Redskins offense to generate more than one first down in any drive and held them to 197 yards of total offense... __________________ The Sports Curmudgeon www.sportscurmudgeon.com But don't get me wrong, I love sports...

10-11-2004, 05:56 AM	#13
Luxorreb ^21^ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Richmond, Virginia Age: 52 Posts: 1,630	D played a good game. Allowed 3 pts. Played hard all season and without Barrow or for 3 weeks Arrington. For a noname DL also missing Daniels they've done a great job. This is the first week they've let a back go over 100 yds or even close to that all season. Sure they could play better at the end of the game, but what else do ya want? They had 3 INTS in the 1st half. Blame the offense for the loss if ya blame anyone. I'm not into scapegoats but if I was I'd blame Betts and Brunell. Sure as hell can't blame the refs for this one! __________________ ^21^

10-11-2004, 10:39 AM	#14
sportscurmudgeon Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,159	Let me correct soemthing I put in my previous post in this thread. The Redskins did indeed make more than one first down in one of their drives last night. They had one drive with two first downs; it was the drive that ended with Deion's interception. I overlooked that drive when I glanced at my game chart. My mistake; the Ravens defense did allow that to happen. If you don't care about yardage and time of posession as a statistic to worry about over the course of an entire game or a season you are absolutely correct. When the Rams won the Super Bowl, they only led in time of posession in two or three games for the whole season. It can be a very misleading stat. I am not blaming the defense for losing last night's game; you can hang the blame directly on the offensive line because they stunk like a skunk's butt. But this thread started with the Redskins' defense being called arguably the best in the league. Well, I argue that they are good but nowhere near the best in the league. And time of possession in a critical part of last night's game is one reason they are not the best. Here are my notes from my game chart - as best as I can read them because I never did well in penmanship: Ravens 17 - Skins 10 4th quarter 10:16 to play. Baltimore ball. 1st and 10 at the Baltimore 8 Jamal Lewis runs three times for a first down at the Balt 20 (8:53 to play) Lewis out; Chester Taylor runs twice for a first down at the Balt 31 (7:37 to play) Jamal Lewis tackled for a 3 yard loss Jamal Lewis gains one yard Kyle Boller throws incomplete pass (time remaining 5:43) On that posession the Ravens managed to consume almost 50% of the time remaining in the game. This is a point in the game where a field goal is of little or no value; the offense needs the ball in good field position with some time left to maneuver. The defense did not do that for them. But amazingly, the Ravens gave the Skins good field position because of Hartwell's brain cramp that caused him to take off his helmet on the field. So the Ravens gave the Skins what the Skins' defense could not give them - really good field position. And then the offense went three and out with a net gain of zero yards. Balt gets the ball back with 4:50 to play. The offense held the ball for all of 46 seconds. So the defense had another chance to force a turnover or force a three and out to give the offense one more shot - which would probably have been futile anyway given the way the game had been going. But iot was the only hope. Didn't happen. If my counting is correct, the Ravens ran the ball 8 consecutive plays for 53 yards - that's 6.6 yards per carry for those keeping score at home. Then they knelt down and let the game expire. Remember, I DID NOT say the defense lost that game; the offense lost it But I am saying that if you want to call this the best defense in the league you have to explain how they allowed the Ravens to hold the ball for 9 minutes and 30 seconds in the final 10 minutes and 16 seconds of the game. That is 93% of the time that the Baltimore offense held the ball during crunch time. If this is arguably the best defense in the league, would you also say that Baltimore has arguably the best offense in the league? I hope not. Remember, all the Skins needed was one score to tie it up. Time of posession mattered a whole lot here and it would be worthwhile to worry about it a lot if this becomes a pattern... __________________ The Sports Curmudgeon www.sportscurmudgeon.com But don't get me wrong, I love sports...

10-11-2004, 01:16 AM	#3
skinsguy Pro Bowl Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Greensboro, North Carolina Posts: 6,766	Yet the defense can't carry the offense forever. Yeah it was frustrating but face it..the d just got tired! If the O can score more than 10 - 17 points a game we wouldn't be discussing the defense.

10-11-2004, 01:20 AM	#4
wolfeskins The Starter Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: chesapeake,va. Posts: 2,160	the d did stop the ravens near the end of the game.the skins o got the ball back with around 5 minutes left,they went 3 and out

10-11-2004, 01:26 AM	#5
rickmmrr Special Teams Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 395	The defense did there job. The offense sucks.

10-11-2004, 01:32 AM	#6
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 52 Posts: 99,518	The D has done their jobs all season. If we had any hint of an offense things would be much different.

10-11-2004, 01:35 AM	#8
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 52 Posts: 99,518	You can't blame this one on the D tonight. Yeah they wore down in crunchtime but the offense hung them out to dry tonight. The D was on the field way too long, and against a physcial team like the Ravens eventually they're going to break you.

10-11-2004, 02:32 AM	#9
redwagonskins Impact Rookie Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: San Diego Posts: 685	Even Joe says you have to score 21 poitns to have a chance at winning. I think our D would agree with that.

10-11-2004, 04:22 AM	#10
itvnetop Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Los Angeles, CA Age: 47 Posts: 3,007	there's no way you can pin this on the D... how many three and outs did our offense have? the D is the only reason we scored tonight... it would have been 17-0 if it wasn't for them... probably worse.

10-11-2004, 05:25 AM	#12
That Guy Living Legend Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: VA Age: 42 Posts: 17,553	jamal didn't get a TD did he? i was right to bench him for emmitt smith btw... jamal is 11 points, while emmitt is 13 this week.

10-11-2004, 10:44 AM	#15
MTK \m/ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: NY Age: 52 Posts: 99,518	I wonder how much better our D would look if the offense could sustain some time consuming drives to let them rest a bit.

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