Kirk Cousins 24/7 thread

[mooby]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

You should find a way to tell Scot M, because he believes that you can't do both.

Does he believe that? Or does he just say it in public because he doesn't want to give up what little leverage we have? There is a difference between the two.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by SFREDSKIN

Opening round of playoffs helps establish Kirk Cousins' value - Washington Redskins Blog- ESPN

That is an awesome article; everyone should take the time to read it. IMO after reading it you gamble and pay KC the money.

[SolidSnake84]

Originally Posted by MTK

If SM doesn't believe in paying a QB I'm still trying to figure out why he gave KC $20m last year. Definitely would like to hear more on this.

In my opinion, as far as last year was concerned, they basically said "we really aren't sure about your ability, but we don't really have time to look for a replacement". Of course 2017 decision making is going to be very different. Kirk has proven to be an NFL starting QB. It comes down to money at this point. I wish we could give him between 21 and 23 million a year, but I don't think we will offer that. For some reason the number i have stuck in my head is 18 million a season for four seasons.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

In my opinion, as far as last year was concerned, they basically said "we really aren't sure about your ability, but we don't really have time to look for a replacement". Of course 2017 decision making is going to be very different. Kirk has proven to be an NFL starting QB. It comes down to money at this point. I wish we could give him between 21 and 23 million a year, but I don't think we will offer that. For some reason the number i have stuck in my head is 18 million a season for four seasons.

They paid 20Million last season by your own words saying Prove it. He proved his ability, so why would they say ok, now we will give you 18Million. That's not even a logical position.

Maybe they say ok, last year on a prove it deal we gave you the franchise tag number, this year we want to make it a long term deal so the average per year will be a little less then franchise tag value, but with 2 years franchise tag value guaranteed. That number would be 23Mill apy and 58Mill Guaranteed. That's the negotiating numbers right there. Anything less is a fan's creation, not the team's expectation.

[SolidSnake84]

Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule

They paid 20Million last season by your own words saying Prove it. He proved his ability, so why would they say ok, now we will give you 18Million. That's not even a logical position.

Maybe they say ok, last year on a prove it deal we gave you the franchise tag number, this year we want to make it a long term deal so the average per year will be a little less then franchise tag value, but with 2 years franchise tag value guaranteed. That number would be 23Mill apy and 58Mill Guaranteed. That's the negotiating numbers right there. Anything less is a fan's creation, not the team's expectation.

i imagined there would be lots of incentives that he would have to reach to get his yearly number above 20 million (Throw for 4,000 yards, Throw 30 TD's, play in 90% of the snaps, start all 16 games, etc....)

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

In my opinion, as far as last year was concerned, they basically said "we really aren't sure about your ability, but we don't really have time to look for a replacement". Of course 2017 decision making is going to be very different. Kirk has proven to be an NFL starting QB. It comes down to money at this point. I wish we could give him between 21 and 23 million a year, but I don't think we will offer that. For some reason the number i have stuck in my head is 18 million a season for four seasons.

He won't sign for $18M per season. Why should he? He can just sign the franchise tag contract again and be guaranteed $24 in 2017. That adds up to $43M fully guaranteed over two seasons and then he can negotiate again prior to the 2018 season. That is a no-brainer for Kirk.

[CRedskinsRule]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

i imagined there would be lots of incentives that he would have to reach to get his yearly number above 20 million (Throw for 4,000 yards, Throw 30 TD's, play in 90% of the snaps, start all 16 games, etc....)

I don't understand your position at all. They paid 20Million guaranteed, no incentives nothing. They are ready to pay 24Million guaranteed, no incentives nothing. KC is a top FA candidate if we don't sign him, Far better than a Brock equivalent. Some team is going to overpay him if he hits FA, that is what happens. If we try to say 20M plus incentives he would walk away in a heartbeat and the Skins aren't letting that happen.

SO

The Skins choices are :
FT him at 24 guaranteed for 1 year and put themselves in a terrible bargaining position next year ... or ...
Sign a long term Team Friendly deal that gives him an apy between 22.5 and 25M with guarantees starting around 58Million (2 year FT - 24M+34M) and incentivize the later years.

And KC is going to sign with the Skins. He knows the system, knows he has receivers and the support of the HC, and knows what he did here the last two years.

The rest of this is just fan hufferpuff

[Bucket]

Originally Posted by SolidSnake84

i imagined there would be lots of incentives that he would have to reach to get his yearly number above 20 million (Throw for 4,000 yards, Throw 30 TD's, play in 90% of the snaps, start all 16 games, etc....)

How old are you Snake? I am going to attempt to not be disrespectful but you sound like a dumb fucking kid who grew up playing madden and smashing the fantasy draft option while turning off salary cap.

Do you not understand market value?

Do you not understand leverage?

Do you not watch other NFL QB play in other NFL games?

I keep seeing you say things and use words like "incentives" but I dont think you understand how it all fucking works. Its making my god damn head hurt.

You want to keep the QB position around 12-14% of your total salary cap. The cap itself will conting to grow for a few years. What does that mean? Well, it means that the % of value will continue to rise as long as the NFL needs average to good QB'S.

Let me break it down for you in a different example.

Okay, say you buy a diamond earing today for $1000 dollars. Pretty steep right? Well, let's say somehow planet earth manages to find and mine a whole planet of diamonds far away and brings it all back to Earth. Well, the value of the diamond just became less demanding. So now, you will get that earing for even less. Lets say... $200.

Okay, now lets reverse that. Lets say you just bought the last diamond earing on earth because as soon as you put it on, every other diamond on earth went fucking poof and vanished! NOW, your diamonds value has increased! You could probably get it for 5x the amount you initially invested for.

Thats kinda how the QB position works in the NFL right now. With less QB play, we have to pay for more value. Especially when teams like the Texans pay 20 million to a guy named Brock Osweiler and he sucks ass. So, guess what? That made the position EVEN more valuable!!

Another example would be.... If Aaron Rodgers was to get offered a contract tomorrow. He would probably make close to 28 million dollars a years because hes considered a tier 1 QB which is even more valuable then a tier 2 QB. Guess what Kirk is?

Yep.. You guessed it. Hes a Tier 2 QB. So guess what his value stands around? Hes going to get offered more then his tag or he wont accept it. Want to know why? Because he has leverage. Ohhhh. There is that leverage word again.

Leverage means you basically have the person you cranking a deal with by the fucking balls because the stupid fucks decided to tag you the year before instead of offering 19-20 million LAST year. When the VALUE of the position was lower.

The draft is also adding to this value because there isnt 1...NOT 1 starting caliber QB coming out this year yet.. So, that adds... You wanna guess???

VALUE!!!! There it is again. It adds value to the poisition and allows Kirk agent to have MORE leverage!!!

So please do yourself a favor.. Look up current % market of QB and the % of each cap per team. Also google how much the cap will be increasing by that % each year.

Then.. do yourself one more favor and shut the fuck up about "incentives" and 18 million dollar contracts. You cant offer anyone "incentive" based fucking contracts when they have all the fucking leverage. Hes going to get what hes going to get Gauranteed. There will only be incentives after hes earned his VALUE.

Please understand the difference or stop posting. It gives me the shits.

Thank you. Maybe I could of been nicer but you seem to not get it. I apologize for being rude.

[SolidSnake84]

Originally Posted by Bucket

How old are you Snake? I am going to attempt to not be disrespectful but you sound like a dumb fucking kid who grew up playing madden and smashing the fantasy draft option while turning off salary cap.

Do you not understand market value?

Do you not understand leverage?

Do you not watch other NFL QB play in other NFL games?

I keep seeing you say things and use words like "incentives" but I dont think you understand how it all fucking works. Its making my god damn head hurt.

You want to keep the QB position around 12-14% of your total salary cap. The cap itself will conting to grow for a few years. What does that mean? Well, it means that the % of value will continue to rise as long as the NFL needs average to good QB'S.

Let me break it down for you in a different example.

Okay, say you buy a diamond earing today for $1000 dollars. Pretty steep right? Well, let's say somehow planet earth manages to find and mine a whole planet of diamonds far away and brings it all back to Earth. Well, the value of the diamond just became less demanding. So now, you will get that earing for even less. Lets say... $200.

Okay, now lets reverse that. Lets say you just bought the last diamond earing on earth because as soon as you put it on, every other diamond on earth went fucking poof and vanished! NOW, your diamonds value has increased! You could probably get it for 5x the amount you initially invested for.

Thats kinda how the QB position works in the NFL right now. With less QB play, we have to pay for more value. Especially when teams like the Texans pay 20 million to a guy named Brock Osweiler and he sucks ass. So, guess what? That made the position EVEN more valuable!!

Another example would be.... If Aaron Rodgers was to get offered a contract tomorrow. He would probably make close to 28 million dollars a years because hes considered a tier 1 QB which is even more valuable then a tier 2 QB. Guess what Kirk is?

Yep.. You guessed it. Hes a Tier 2 QB. So guess what his value stands around? Hes going to get offered more then his tag or he wont accept it. Want to know why? Because he has leverage. Ohhhh. There is that leverage word again.

Leverage means you basically have the person you cranking a deal with by the fucking balls because the stupid fucks decided to tag you the year before instead of offering 19-20 million LAST year. When the VALUE of the position was lower.

The draft is also adding to this value because there isnt 1...NOT 1 starting caliber QB coming out this year yet.. So, that adds... You wanna guess???

VALUE!!!! There it is again. It adds value to the poisition and allows Kirk agent to have MORE leverage!!!

So please do yourself a favor.. Look up current % market of QB and the % of each cap per team. Also google how much the cap will be increasing by that % each year.

Then.. do yourself one more favor and shut the fuck up about "incentives" and 18 million dollar contracts. You cant offer anyone "incentive" based fucking contracts when they have all the fucking leverage. Hes going to get what hes going to get Gauranteed. There will only be incentives after hes earned his VALUE.

Please understand the difference or stop posting. It gives me the shits.

Thank you. Maybe I could of been nicer but you seem to not get it. I apologize for being rude.

I don't think you were rude at all. I appreciate your post, in it I read things that I did not know. This Cousins situation, for me, I believe is the most difficult situation i've had to watch unfold.

[MTK]

I've outlined this before, 3 years of the franchise tag would equal $77m, you can bet that's the starting off point for Kirk's camp. I think it will end up more like 22 or 23 per, but they can make it look as pretty as they want on paper as far as the yearly figure. What really matters is the guaranteed money and how it's all structured.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by Bucket

How old are you Snake? I am going to attempt to not be disrespectful but you sound like a dumb fucking kid who grew up playing madden and smashing the fantasy draft option while turning off salary cap.

Do you not understand market value?

Do you not understand leverage?

Do you not watch other NFL QB play in other NFL games?

I keep seeing you say things and use words like "incentives" but I dont think you understand how it all fucking works. Its making my god damn head hurt.

You want to keep the QB position around 12-14% of your total salary cap. The cap itself will conting to grow for a few years. What does that mean? Well, it means that the % of value will continue to rise as long as the NFL needs average to good QB'S.

Let me break it down for you in a different example.

Okay, say you buy a diamond earing today for $1000 dollars. Pretty steep right? Well, let's say somehow planet earth manages to find and mine a whole planet of diamonds far away and brings it all back to Earth. Well, the value of the diamond just became less demanding. So now, you will get that earing for even less. Lets say... $200.

Okay, now lets reverse that. Lets say you just bought the last diamond earing on earth because as soon as you put it on, every other diamond on earth went fucking poof and vanished! NOW, your diamonds value has increased! You could probably get it for 5x the amount you initially invested for.

Thats kinda how the QB position works in the NFL right now. With less QB play, we have to pay for more value. Especially when teams like the Texans pay 20 million to a guy named Brock Osweiler and he sucks ass. So, guess what? That made the position EVEN more valuable!!

Another example would be.... If Aaron Rodgers was to get offered a contract tomorrow. He would probably make close to 28 million dollars a years because hes considered a tier 1 QB which is even more valuable then a tier 2 QB. Guess what Kirk is?

Yep.. You guessed it. Hes a Tier 2 QB. So guess what his value stands around? Hes going to get offered more then his tag or he wont accept it. Want to know why? Because he has leverage. Ohhhh. There is that leverage word again.

Leverage means you basically have the person you cranking a deal with by the fucking balls because the stupid fucks decided to tag you the year before instead of offering 19-20 million LAST year. When the VALUE of the position was lower.

The draft is also adding to this value because there isnt 1...NOT 1 starting caliber QB coming out this year yet.. So, that adds... You wanna guess???

VALUE!!!! There it is again. It adds value to the poisition and allows Kirk agent to have MORE leverage!!!

So please do yourself a favor.. Look up current % market of QB and the % of each cap per team. Also google how much the cap will be increasing by that % each year.

Then.. do yourself one more favor and shut the fuck up about "incentives" and 18 million dollar contracts. You cant offer anyone "incentive" based fucking contracts when they have all the fucking leverage. Hes going to get what hes going to get Gauranteed. There will only be incentives after hes earned his VALUE.

Please understand the difference or stop posting. It gives me the shits.

Thank you. Maybe I could of been nicer but you seem to not get it. I apologize for being rude.

I just think there still be more value for a earth found diamond vs. one from Planet Diamond. Just say'n

[MTK]

And $18m per year just isn't going to happen, that offer would get laughed out of the room and would be a flat out insult. You don't pay a guy $20 one year and come back with $18 the next. That's not how this works.

[mredskins]

Originally Posted by MTK

And $18m per year just isn't going to happen, that offer would get laughed out of the room and would be a flat out insult. You don't pay a guy $20 one year and come back with $18 the next. That's not how this works.

So 17? I am not following.

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by mredskins

So 17? I am not following.

Smart ass!

[KI Skins Fan]

Originally Posted by Bucket

Leverage means you basically have the person you cranking a deal with by the fucking balls because the stupid fucks decided to tag you the year before instead of offering 19-20 million LAST year. When the VALUE of the position was lower.

LOL! That should get your point across.

SolidSnake, You're a fun poster but if you don't up your fantasy GM game soon I fear that Bucket may ask Matty to change your screen name to something like ShakySnake. That would teach you!

p.s. I say that in jest and with all good will toward you. Keep on truckin'!